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Post by mylungswereaching on Nov 10, 2015 21:20:19 GMT -5
I just don't see Rifftrax and MST3k as competitors. A lot of people who like one will like the other. Joel is talking about a dozen episodes a year. That's why there is a button on Netflix that says something like if you liked this show why not try this other show. There are about a hundred NCIS shows and other shows like it on TV. Are they competitors? Not really. The people who buy a show tend to buy other shows like it. A really successful MST3k would increase Rifftax sales not decrease them, especially if they cross advertised.
I wouldn't try to read too much into one or two tweets. I'd let it ride for a while. Trace can't say that he's the only real Crow with Bill around. Now there will be a new voice of Crow. It's just like a new Doctor Who. Time passes.
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Torgo
Moderator Emeritus
-segment with Crow?
Posts: 15,420
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Post by Torgo on Nov 10, 2015 21:40:47 GMT -5
NCIS is of the same franchise, on the same network, and money all goes to the same place. MST and Rifftrax are two different projects with profits going in different directions.
Mike may not hold any ill will against a reboot of the show, but he has the right to not wish to promote it. He never did with Cinematic Titanic, and I don't see why he would here. It's something else that he has no handle on.
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Post by Mod City on Nov 10, 2015 21:42:33 GMT -5
On Twitter, Trace seems almost outright hostile about it. Saying that there WILL NOT even be so much as a cameo from him. This is rather depressing. I just skimmed his tweets and I don't see much hostile about it. If there is anything short about them I imagine it's probably from hundreds of tweets about the same thing hitting him at once. Especially since it looks like he's trying to advertise live appearances by him and Frank and probably doesn't really care what Joel is doing. As for the Rifftrax guys, I don't really see why they would be advertising a future competitor. They're happy with their own project and don't seem intent on ending it any time soon. That's probably the main thing behind it all. They have worked hard on Rifftrax over the years, really built it up and learned how to sustain it, and now own it themselves, from what I understand. And I've been a fan from the start - they're excellent at what they do. The fact they're selling MST3K eps shows that connections still exist in some form. It's not really fair to judge them based on retweets or not being all "WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!" And the whole crew appears to not be coming back, so Joel will have to be our guide. He emphasized the new cast all-around and his excitement about it, so I'll sit back, throw them some support and see what comes of all this.
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Post by Triple_sSs on Nov 10, 2015 22:19:10 GMT -5
So here's more of my thoughts on the reboot that I posted elsewhere:
Yes, I’m really excited about the Kickstarter and super stoked that we should finally be getting new MST3K! However, I also see some people are acting rather cautious (even hostile) about it too.
Frankly I’d be lying if I wasn’t a little apprehensive myself, but so far I like what I see. Yeah it’s gonna be different with a whole new cast, but I think the voices in the new video sound pretty decent. I’d have to get used to them of course but I’m kinda digging the new Crow here. As long as they’re still funny I don’t have a problem.
I know there’s lots to be worried about but I have faith in Joel, He started it all and I’m sure he knows what he’s going. And since the show has been off the air for a long time, things are obviously gonna change; honestly the original guys are getting pretty old and aren’t gonna be around forever. Think of it more like “MST3K: The Next Generation”, a chance to introduce the show to a whole new group of fans, I find that exciting.
So come on guys, let’s give this a chance.
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Post by Shark on Nov 10, 2015 22:58:50 GMT -5
Wow - over 800K already! And 10/15 chances to have an appearance in an episode are already gone.
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Post by SoCalChevy on Nov 10, 2015 23:03:53 GMT -5
And apparently Joel has his own company now. I wonder what Mallon's new company has to do with this?
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Post by mylungswereaching on Nov 10, 2015 23:32:14 GMT -5
NCIS is of the same franchise, on the same network, and money all goes to the same place. MST and Rifftrax are two different projects with profits going in different directions. Mike may not hold any ill will against a reboot of the show, but he has the right to not wish to promote it. He never did with Cinematic Titanic, and I don't see why he would here. It's something else that he has no handle on. Better example Marvel vs DC. I would bet that a lot of the people who have been watching the new show Supergirl are also fans of the various Marvel products. Superhero shows and movies are hot right now. If you put out a good product, it will sell. DC and Marvel won't promote each other but they don't hurt each other, unless they are in the same time slot, at least not until they have over saturated the market. If the new MST3k is successful it won't hurt Rifftrax. Mike has a perfect right not to promote MST3k. If he wants to make more money and he plays it right, promoting MST3k might help his brand much more than hurt it. Do a cameo on MST3k with the explicit agreement that he can promote Rifftrax on it. I'm sure they can come up with a funny way to do it.
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Post by mrtorso on Nov 10, 2015 23:55:53 GMT -5
I HATE TOM SERVO'S NEW VOICE!! (and crow's and the host's)
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Post by SoCalChevy on Nov 10, 2015 23:56:33 GMT -5
Ok I'm also a bit apprehensive about the reboot because I don't want too many of the riffs to be current references. I mean, I'm 22 and I even I don't listen to a lot of new music. And i like it when I get an older reference because it feels obscure to me, even when it isn't to people of previous generations.
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Post by BoB3K on Nov 11, 2015 0:12:33 GMT -5
Ok I'm also a bit apprehensive about the reboot because I don't want too many of the riffs to be current references. I mean, I'm 22 and I even I don't listen to a lot of new music. And i like it when I get an older reference because it feels obscure to me, even when it isn't to people of previous generations. Yeah, same here! ...except I'm 40
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Post by mylungswereaching on Nov 11, 2015 0:25:32 GMT -5
Joel was in his late 20's when he started MST3k. Cultural riffs were taken anywhere from his childhood on, so the late 1960's on. One thing that made it easier was that if you were riffing on television shows from that era, there were only three channels. So even though I never watched a show like the Brady Bunch, I knew what it was about and could still get the riffs, sometimes. And since there was no internet, or vcrs or other distractions, most kids watched TV so there is a wealth of material that Joel could be sure a lot of the people who were around his age would remember and get. It's tough to forget a commercial you saw 5 or 10 times a day for 10 years.
So lets say the new cast is about the same age as Joel was when he started the show. That would mean that they were born right about the time that MST3k was first on the air in the late 1980's. So their cultural riffs would start in the mid to late 1990's until current. They would have childhood and teenage memories of the times that MST3k was on the air for the first time.
MST3k has always had obscure riffs. It should always have obscure riffs. Part of the fun of the show is being the only one in a group to get a riff. But the bulk of the riffs, have to be understandable by most of the audience. Riffing on the movie is one way. But there aren't a lot of things that everyone knows about anymore. Theres a few things that will probably work. A good percentage of people know movies like the Wizard of Oz or Star Wars and even if they haven't seen them, most know about them. I'm not sure what else they could riff on that a high enough percentage of people would get. Music is segmented now. If you look at a current teenagers music collection now, it is much more diverse than it was in the past.
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Post by SoCalChevy on Nov 11, 2015 1:08:01 GMT -5
Joel was in his late 20's when he started MST3k. Cultural riffs were taken anywhere from his childhood on, so the late 1960's on. One thing that made it easier was that if you were riffing on television shows from that era, there were only three channels. So even though I never watched a show like the Brady Bunch, I knew what it was about and could still get the riffs, sometimes. And since there was no internet, or vcrs or other distractions, most kids watched TV so there is a wealth of material that Joel could be sure a lot of the people who were around his age would remember and get. It's tough to forget a commercial you saw 5 or 10 times a day for 10 years. So lets say the new cast is about the same age as Joel was when he started the show. That would mean that they were born right about the time that MST3k was first on the air in the late 1980's. So their cultural riffs would start in the mid to late 1990's until current. They would have childhood and teenage memories of the times that MST3k was on the air for the first time. MST3k has always had obscure riffs. It should always have obscure riffs. Part of the fun of the show is being the only one in a group to get a riff. But the bulk of the riffs, have to be understandable by most of the audience. Riffing on the movie is one way. But there aren't a lot of things that everyone knows about anymore. Theres a few things that will probably work. A good percentage of people know movies like the Wizard of Oz or Star Wars and even if they haven't seen them, most know about them. I'm not sure what else they could riff on that a high enough percentage of people would get. Music is segmented now. If you look at a current teenagers music collection now, it is much more diverse than it was in the past. But see, my generation was (and is still being) raised by Joel's generation. And at least for me, that means they have taught me some of their cultural references. I've never seen "Green Acres" but I know what the theme song sounded like because I've heard my mom sing it. And speaking of music, one of my friends in high school loved Pink Floyd and T-Rex. So, I do not want them to just discount riffs referencing things from decades ago. Some of us will still get it. And it would seem more special if it's a riff that not everyone our age knows.
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Post by SoCalChevy on Nov 11, 2015 11:43:51 GMT -5
Joel was in his late 20's when he started MST3k. Cultural riffs were taken anywhere from his childhood on, so the late 1960's on. One thing that made it easier was that if you were riffing on television shows from that era, there were only three channels. So even though I never watched a show like the Brady Bunch, I knew what it was about and could still get the riffs, sometimes. And since there was no internet, or vcrs or other distractions, most kids watched TV so there is a wealth of material that Joel could be sure a lot of the people who were around his age would remember and get. It's tough to forget a commercial you saw 5 or 10 times a day for 10 years. So lets say the new cast is about the same age as Joel was when he started the show. That would mean that they were born right about the time that MST3k was first on the air in the late 1980's. So their cultural riffs would start in the mid to late 1990's until current. They would have childhood and teenage memories of the times that MST3k was on the air for the first time. MST3k has always had obscure riffs. It should always have obscure riffs. Part of the fun of the show is being the only one in a group to get a riff. But the bulk of the riffs, have to be understandable by most of the audience. Riffing on the movie is one way. But there aren't a lot of things that everyone knows about anymore. Theres a few things that will probably work. A good percentage of people know movies like the Wizard of Oz or Star Wars and even if they haven't seen them, most know about them. I'm not sure what else they could riff on that a high enough percentage of people would get. Music is segmented now. If you look at a current teenagers music collection now, it is much more diverse than it was in the past. But see, my generation was (and is still being) raised by Joel's generation. And at least for me, that means they have taught me some of their cultural references. I've never seen "Green Acres" but I know what the theme song sounded like because I've heard my mom sing it. And speaking of music, one of my friends in high school loved Pink Floyd and T-Rex. So, I do not want them to just discount riffs referencing things from decades ago. Some of us will still get it. And it would seem more special if it's a riff that not everyone our age knows. I guess what I should say is that I think between older and younger viewers plenty of those older riffs will still reach that "critical mass" of people who get them, even when they aren't about classics like the Wizard of Oz.
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Post by BoB3K on Nov 11, 2015 11:55:00 GMT -5
There are still plenty of wide-ranging pop culture riffs. I've never watched an episode of Breaking Bad (ain't my thing no matter how good the writing/acting), but I know quite a bit about it, even many of the 'spoilers,' and would probably 'get' a riff referencing it. Plus, stuff like modern politics that any half way informed person show be aware of.
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Post by Shark on Nov 12, 2015 19:12:21 GMT -5
Per Joel on Kickstarter
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