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Post by Who Let Servo Drive on Jun 18, 2014 12:26:08 GMT -5
Hence my question before. From oblique, and not so oblique, references from various people involved with the show, it seems Mallon has not especially endeared himself to the creative talent behind MST, and if he's going to be a part of this (and one assumes he is) MST alums will not be pushing each other out of the way to get involved.
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Post by Crowfan on Jun 18, 2014 13:40:19 GMT -5
Basically Jim Mallon believes he invented movie riffing. When Mike, Bill,and Kevin did "The Film Crew" it was Jim Mallon who told them to "cease and desist" because they were stealing his idea. I've met the Cinematic Titanic folks, and have spent a lot of time with Mary Jo Pehl(she hosted a Meet Up in 2008, when we still did those)and basically they don't want to say anything about Jim. I think Joel is the only one who got money from MST, and that was a hassle for him.(not sure I'm remembering that exactly right). Nobody else ever got any money from the show.
While a reboot would be nice, I'm not sure if 1)it could actually happen without's Jim Mallon's approval and 2)that the cast we know and love would come back and do it.
Maybe it will happen. It certainly could, at some point. If it does, I would support it, and I'm sure most people around here would as well, but that probably goes without saying.
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Post by Mod City on Jun 18, 2014 14:05:41 GMT -5
We've been over this so many times, and now it's creeping into this thread, too. The MST3K crew simply does not want to get back together, period! Whatever happens under the Mystery Science Theater 3000 name will have to involve Jim. If Joel and Jim come up with something with all new players and so forth, well, then so be it. But there comes a point where it doesn't pay to keep asking the same questions we all know the answers to. Certain factions of the Brains simply do not like each other and will not be working together in the future.
It's a sad truth but it's time to start accepting it.
As for new characters and so forth, I'd like to see them bring in someone with some professional comedic experience. The web-based riff projects out there are nice, and open auditions could be fun, but I think they need to go outside the riffing world to recast. If that's what they decide to do.
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Post by Who Let Servo Drive on Jun 18, 2014 15:32:13 GMT -5
I agree wholeheartedly with both previous messages, although my opinion is not based on knowing any of the people involved so really is just based on what I read.
But despite all of that it's still interesting that Joel has been talking about this so much. He's not a dumb guy and I assume that he would not be going public with these ideas if Mallon were not in the loop somehow. And if he is, then I assume that the show will not involve any of the old team, except maybe Joel, and maybe Paul Chaplin? He worked on the flash series, such as it was, but I think I remember reading he was not thrilled with that experience. (Shocking.)
I wonder if Mallon really thinks that he invented riffing. I would think that he may have sent a C&D letter to The Film Crew because he felt he currently owned the copyright on riffing, rather than because he was its creator. Of course, that's ridiculous, but at least it's incrementally closer to passing the straight-face test.
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Post by Mod City on Jun 18, 2014 15:42:17 GMT -5
I've never met any of the Brains, either, but you're right – the prickly nature of everyone's relationship has been right out in front of us since the old days and should have been blatantly obvious as soon as both Rifftrax and Cinematic Titanic were up and running at the same time. Interview after interview they passive aggressively dodge questions about the other camp. They all have this reserved midwest attitude where nobody talks about it, nobody badmouths each other in public and they just let it be. So instead of just coming out and saying "I won't work with so-and-so" they tiptoe around it, which tends to lead a lot of people on.
I figure Joel and Jim are probably together on this, if I had to guess. And it could work with new people, they just need the right one/ones.
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Post by Who Let Servo Drive on Jun 18, 2014 15:49:14 GMT -5
Ok, so you are talking about the onair talent at the end of the series -- Murphy, Corbett and Nelson -- maybe not wanting to work with the other folks, and/or vice versa? I guess that's possible, but as you say, they never come out and say so, so it might or might not be as bad as all that. I get a sense that it's clearly everyone vs Mallon, although it's certainly conceivable that the three guys who hung on and did the show longest might prefer to work together than with people who left (and when people left, once again, it seems largely to have had to do with Mallon -- certainly Joel and Trace, as they have said so).
It's all tea leaf reading at this point -- I doubt that if there is any sense of rivalry that we'll ever be told about it, and to be completely honest I am not sure I really even want to know.
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Post by Mod City on Jun 18, 2014 16:56:34 GMT -5
Well, I think that's the most obvious schism, but I wasn't necessarily referring to those two groups specifically. Mallon has obviously upset members of both those camps, too. And didn't Shep post awhile back about having lunch with Trace and Frank and mentioning the reboot idea? I seem to remember he said their reaction was lukewarm at best.
I'm guessing, as Triple_sSs pointed out over at IndyPopCon, that those guys will all be invited back but very few, if any, will accept. It also indicated a new host and new bot wranglers, so we don't have to worry too much about Bill, Trace, Kevin, Josh, Joel or Mike in prominent roles. So much the better – less Trace vs. Bill and Kevin vs. Josh, and so forth.
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Post by zetastrike on Jun 19, 2014 9:35:58 GMT -5
But really, Bill shouldn't return to the show if it comes back. It's been 15 years since the last episode, so Crow has already gone through two more voices.
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Post by Mod City on Jun 19, 2014 11:55:08 GMT -5
But really, Bill shouldn't return to the show if it comes back. It's been 15 years since the last episode, so Crow has already gone through two more voices. And there's your plot device to introduce a new Crow! In all seriousness, I'd love to see old cast members return in some form, I just think it's unlikely, and that's fine. It's time for a new bunch to take this concept and build on it. If Joel is on board, that's pretty much good enough for me.
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Post by Treadwell on Aug 8, 2014 18:45:42 GMT -5
Saw Joel at a con last weekend. In his panel (a sped-up hour-long version of Riffing Myself), he said he would've hesitated to say anything since it's not 100% confirmed yet, but the Wired article spilled the beans.
He said he'd recollect the Brains, but I didn't catch the context of that, whether any had expressed interest or had actually signed on. He said on-camera performers would be new young folks, leaving he and his fellow "old people" behind the scenes. He didn't mention Mallon being involved.
Later, as we talked bots at his table (I brought my Tom and Crow), he said the bots would have changes--Tom would separate between the skirt and the barrel, and between the barrel and the head, connected by something like dryer hose, so that he could be more articulate and would be shown hovering. I asked if that meant he wouldn't be carried into the theater, and he said the change wouldn't necessarily preclude that.
He said Crow will have legs now, and I didn't get into the fact that he was shown with legs a few times already.
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Post by Triple_sSs on Aug 8, 2014 19:04:24 GMT -5
Saw Joel at a con last weekend. In his panel (a sped-up hour-long version of Riffing Myself), he said he would've hesitated to say anything since it's not 100% confirmed yet, but the Wired article spilled the beans. He said he'd recollect the Brains, but I didn't catch the context of that, whether any had expressed interest or had actually signed on. He said on-camera performers would be new young folks, leaving he and his fellow "old people" behind the scenes. He didn't mention Mallon being involved. Later, as we talked bots at his table (I brought my Tom and Crow), he said the bots would have changes--Tom would separate between the skirt and the barrel, and between the barrel and the head, connected by something like dryer hose, so that he could be more articulate and would be shown hovering. I asked if that meant he wouldn't be carried into the theater, and he said the change wouldn't necessarily preclude that. He said Crow will have legs now, and I didn't get into the fact that he was shown with legs a few times already. Now those last bits about the bots sound really interesting to me. If Servo will be actually hovering now, I bet he means Crow will also be standing with his legs too. Perhaps this means they'll become more than just simple stick puppets and could be shown moving around the SOL beyond just that countertop they're always at. It could take some getting used to, but personally I think that would be a really awesome update to see in the revival! I wonder if this means the bots' arms will finally get to work as well.
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Post by Weirdo Writer on Aug 8, 2014 19:06:12 GMT -5
These descriptions of the 'Bots are making me wonder if they'll still be using strictly practical FX, or if some degree of CG will be involved.
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Torgo
Moderator Emeritus
-segment with Crow?
Posts: 15,420
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Post by Torgo on Aug 8, 2014 23:09:23 GMT -5
With him going into such detail about the bots, my brain has gone from "amusing musing" to "wow this might actually happen."
If it does, I suggest they get home media clearance for the films so we can get season collections.
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Post by Diet Kolos on Aug 10, 2014 18:35:02 GMT -5
Well,good to know it hasn't gone by the wayside yet. I got worried when "spring" came and went and we heard nothing. Here's to hoping we hear something by Turkey Day.
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Post by Udvarnoky on Aug 13, 2014 10:17:27 GMT -5
On the subject of schisms between BBI alumni, I've never bought into the theories that any cast members have had real, long-term beef with each other. Oh, I'm sure that everyone has had their differences, and I'm sure there was some level of professional rivalry between Rifftrax and CT, but anything more serious than that is, as far as I'm concerned, fan-synthesized drama. The only real conflict that there is any hard evidence to support is Jim Mallon vs. Everybody Else. And that reality becomes more clear with every interview.
Has the issue of Mallon potentially having a censoring influence on some of the Shout!-produced retrospectives been brought up? An old interview with Joel indicates that some of Joel's words about departing over the movie were edited out of the final documentary for that big 20th anniversary Shout! feature (2008ish). And I can remember reading that Joel was supposedly one of the interview subjects Ballyhoo had for their MST3K:TM doc, yet he is nowhere to be seen in the released version. Is it going too far to suspect that Mallon gave "notes" to Shout! when it came to some of the more dramatic anecdotes in BBI's history? I can say that I thought what we got of The Movie documentary was extremely well done, but also way too short and missing crucial information.
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