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Post by Megalon on Nov 26, 2019 20:15:31 GMT -5
The other thread is getting long, and the most important news has already slid off the front page, so let's start a new thread:
From Joel: And begin the wailing and the gnashing of teeth...
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Torgo
Moderator Emeritus
-segment with Crow?
Posts: 15,420
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Post by Torgo on Nov 26, 2019 20:23:05 GMT -5
I've always considered myself lucky that I received more episodes at all, as I was always content with ten seasons in the first place. More hours for me to kick my feet up after a long stressful day and just have some fun. What a gift.
I think I'm siding with optimism about another streaming platform picking the series up. Plenty seem to be friendly with the series, such as Hulu and Prime. And if Shout ever produces original content for their own service, I have a gut feeling MST will be first in line. But even if it doesn't, I'll always have what the show has already given me.
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Post by said43 on Nov 26, 2019 20:26:02 GMT -5
It's not surprising, really. Netflix seems like they don't keep shows around more than a few seasons at this point.
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Post by kmorgan on Nov 26, 2019 20:37:57 GMT -5
This is the third time I've been through this. I can take it. I'll wait until Joel announces the new venue for the next chapter.
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Post by Diet Kolos on Nov 26, 2019 21:04:04 GMT -5
It died as it lived: dead.
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Post by Udvarnoky on Nov 26, 2019 21:32:41 GMT -5
Way I see it, we conned another 20 episodes of this weird show out of some media executives, and that's a win. This show has proven that it isn't really capable of dying, even if it is known to have dramatic interruptions. But between 200+ back episodes and the combined libraries of Rifftrax, The Film Crew and Cinematic Titanic, we have something like eight trillion hours of quality movie riffing to subsist on until the next harvest comes. We feast even in famine.
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Post by angilasman on Nov 26, 2019 23:59:27 GMT -5
I'm happy that Netflix carried the show for two seasons, but it was obvious that the way people watch mst3k was different from the kind of metrics that Netflix looks for in their shows. This is, after all, a company that will cancel even popular shows if they don't think new seasons of it are inspiring more subscribers.
I think Jonah has the right idea: a niche streamer like Shudder would be a better fit. Sure, they don't have pockets as deep as Netflix and that would mean things like shorter seasons, but as a venue designed for cult favorites there the show could be a star in the same vein as their revival of Joe Bob Brigg's horror hosting.
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47
Nanite
I'm weird — which results in creativity!
Posts: 48
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Post by 47 on Nov 27, 2019 1:00:26 GMT -5
Let's hope that whoever sponsors them is open to considering Creative Commons material. There's a wealth of stuff out there with all that wonderfully genuine–effort cheesiness, though you do rather feel like a bad person if you make fun of something which you know was done mostly out–of–pocket — including the donations and endowments from film funds — and with little hopes of ever milking the product for a profit. Rather in the full–half of the glass.
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Post by BoB3K on Nov 27, 2019 2:19:51 GMT -5
So, more than one post on here seems to be mis-remembering / unaware that Netflix didn't do next to sh*t to get MST3K back. Joel ran a kickstarter that made FIVE MILLION DOLLARS to get MST3K back. That money went to creating 90-some percent of season 11. All the kickstarter backers were going to get those 14 eps if they were shown nowhere but on backers TV screens. Netflix then graciously gave Joel a little money to make some 6 episode abomination using their movie choices, a changed format, and their GODAWFUL WHY WON'T IT DIE binginess smeared all over it. F*ck Netflix.
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Post by Afgncaap5 on Nov 27, 2019 4:00:20 GMT -5
Jonah's tweets about it were so sad, but also funny, and a little wry as they noted the company of other cancelled Netflix shows that they'd joined. In a way, it was a perfect statement from a host of this show: sad, but looking toward the optimistic, and also kinda shuffling around awkwardly, looking at the other people still in the room with them. I'm similarly optimistic about the show picking up again from here. Netflix was a nice foot in the door, but I do feel that it'll move on from here. To paraphrase our beloved tot-g...
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Post by Troy's Dad on Nov 27, 2019 12:14:41 GMT -5
Honestly, after the radio silence from Joel and the team on season 12's success (or lack thereof) I never saw a season 13 happening at Netflix. Netflix never even was the genesis of the revival, it was a successful Kickstarter. Season 12 felt like Joel and the crew getting the last bit of whatever they could out of Netflix. The remnants of season 11 production and the season 12 crowd source push probably pushed a season 12 over the top, but that is not a way to sustain the series and bring about a season 13.
I do agree with the assessment that Joel is bad with a budget, he's a creative type who will run wild with the money he is given. Rifftrax feels like a stark contrast to all this, as their live campaigns on Kickstarter always raise the needed funds, and they go into the live events knowing their budget and what they can do to produce a show AND keep things moving from year to year. Sadly, the MST3K revival was just never there.
Best case scenario, I think, is to finish the tour and then have a real discussion with Shout about how much it would cost to produce more seasons that are on par with the original 10 seasons but still has some of the elements 11 and 12 brought to the format. From there, pitch a new season (with the potential for more seasons) to more boutique streamers.
Have a go at Shudder producing a season 13 with a horror theme My idea was Jonah and the bots stop at an old castle when their tour bus breaks down, and the castle ends up being Castle Forrester. From there, Jonah and the bots are trapped in the castle while the mads send them movies from the moon, controlling the castle remotely. Basically it is season 10 in reverse, with the mads in space and the host trapped in the castle. People might complain about a lack of the SOL, but maybe that can be the big reveal in the finale or something.
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Post by Udvarnoky on Nov 27, 2019 12:49:01 GMT -5
I do think there should be a feasible way for Shout! to produce episodes directly, at low volume. They could probably come up with decent projections of how well a volume of four brand new episodes might sell, and reverse engineer a budget. It would no doubt be a fraction of the budget of the episodes of The Return or The Gauntlet, but it should nevertheless be possible in a way that was not when Rhino ran the numbers twenty years ago.
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Post by Diet Kolos on Nov 27, 2019 13:01:29 GMT -5
I figure that the main reason nothing came about 20 years ago with Rhino re:new episodes direct-to-VHS was the same reason nothing came about with AMC: Jim was done and ready to kick back and rake in royalties, and everyone had already moved on, sets torn down, etc.
There SHOULDN'T be those kinds of impediments this time, OTHER THAN any possible exclusivity clause Netflix has. And/or Shout simply CAN'T afford to make the show or doesn't forecast that it'd turn a profit. But to make a profit, they prob ably need to sell to a distributor, which is where the Netflix problem comes in. So one problem leads into the other.
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Post by Troy's Dad on Nov 27, 2019 13:12:52 GMT -5
If Shout wants to get serious about their streaming, maybe even run a paid service, then MST3K would be the first thing they put on it. But in the meantime, I think seeking a smaller streamer with more of a niche is a smart bet.
I've been rewatching Mad Men, and there are always those season enders where Don has it all and he walks away to get back to basics. I feel like Joel needs to accept that MST3K shouldn't be that big production multimillion dollar show. I know Joel is a resourceful guy, hell he built the bots out of what was essentially garbage. I really do think Shout needs to step in, dictate the budget and where it must be spent and give Joel creative control from there. I really do think they could do a low budget season 13 at Shudder. Season the 13th! The concept writes itself.
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Post by Udvarnoky on Nov 27, 2019 13:23:54 GMT -5
Hah! It would be hilarious if MST3K bounced from one streaming service to another, each season themed after its current home's catalog. The Gauntlet sort of set the template, in the sense that it was the Netflix Binge season. And the first batch of episodes of Season 8 could be thought of as The Universal Drive-in stretch. You could do the horror season on Shudder, a family entertainment season on Disney+, a Warner Bros. season on HBO Max... It is the perfect way to adapt MST3K to a world where every media company has its own streaming platform.
Alas, it seems like a pipe dream for the following reasons: no company would give Shout! a year-to-year exclusivity deal, which would be necessary to ensure no lengthy hiatuses between cancellations, and every swap would orphan the episodes of the prior season. Still, I love the sheer promiscuity of the idea.
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