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Post by travis on Jul 6, 2019 14:42:17 GMT -5
Yeah, classic MST3k will forever be a DVD-only show. The Rhino/Shout DVD transfers reveal how low-definition of the original movie broadcast tapes that BBI used were.
Putting 4 episodes on 1 Blu-ray might save some shelf space, but I don't see Shout ever doing that.
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Post by christmas on Jul 7, 2019 2:12:34 GMT -5
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Torgo
Moderator Emeritus
-segment with Crow?
Posts: 15,420
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Post by Torgo on Jul 7, 2019 10:18:02 GMT -5
All by themselves with the aid of a Kickstarter, as well as a print that could be spruced up for HD.
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Post by christmas on Jul 7, 2019 16:34:05 GMT -5
I pointed to Manos as an example that repositioning the SD theater seats over a new HD print is possible. Obviously the difficulty varies from episode to episode. Honestly I agree that MST3K on blu-ray is unlikely. I just think you guys are overselling how STAGGERINGLY IMPOSSIBLE it would be. There are a number of films featured in episodes that have HD masters available.
There's something to be said for positive thinking. There is a person at Shout Factory who is being paid a regular salary and their job is to shake their heads no at projects like this that may or may not be cost prohibitive. They don't need people on message boards like this also trying to do that job. I get that Mad Magazine (RIP) taught us all that a little cynicism is healthy, but sometimes it just happens for it's own sake. To that I say, BLECCH!
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Post by GarrettCRW on Jul 7, 2019 22:57:51 GMT -5
Shout! could easily upscale the show to Blu-ray (possibly without so much as a revision to their existing contracts), and NTSC video scales at an even integer to 1080p (unlike PAL), but they absolutely won't (or can't) invest in methods to clean up video, and have made statements to the effect that they can't, even though the BBC has been doing Doctor Who restorations for over a decade and a half. Besides the tape hits in many MST3K releases, they left a full-on dropout in an episode of Jem (the only Sunbow show where Shout! decided not to release Rhino's half-finished poopie remasters) even though the PAL masters for all the Sunbow shows exist (and none suffer from PAL speed-up). Shout! can do great things when given nice film sources, but as soon as you hand them a video tape (or DON'T, as is often Hasbro's case), everything goes to Hell.
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Post by mitchell33 on Jul 8, 2019 5:06:44 GMT -5
i dunno i know Doctor who is more popular but than you also have Doctor who everywhere and rightly so, i dunno why MSKT3000 didn't take off like that at some point, i mean when Comedy Central had it, lord knows South Park took off like a Rocket and to hazard a guess it's their biggest hit outside the daily show. to hazard another guess a lot of people had BBC and PBS when it came to America or whatever channel it was on. though today Comedy Central is on damn near all of them but back than when it was newer i would not be surprised at all if not as many people had the channel for it to be as big of a hit like South Park seems to be and rightly so as i love both shows.
though today's south park you got me on the quality the early stuff is great though on South Park i have seasons 1-5 on blu-ray and season i think 20 also on blu-ray i'm on season 4 now but i haven't seen that one or season 5 yet and i haven't watched season 20 yet either
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Post by GodzFire on Jul 8, 2019 19:34:11 GMT -5
i dunno i know Doctor who is more popular but than you also have Doctor who everywhere and rightly so, i dunno why MSKT3000 didn't take off like that at some point, i mean when Comedy Central had it, lord knows South Park took off like a Rocket and to hazard a guess it's their biggest hit outside the daily show. to hazard another guess a lot of people had BBC and PBS when it came to America or whatever channel it was on. though today Comedy Central is on damn near all of them but back than when it was newer i would not be surprised at all if not as many people had the channel for it to be as big of a hit like South Park seems to be and rightly so as i love both shows. though today's south park you got me on the quality the early stuff is great though on South Park i have seasons 1-5 on blu-ray and season i think 20 also on blu-ray i'm on season 4 now but i haven't seen that one or season 5 yet and i haven't watched season 20 yet either Capitalization at the start of sentences are your friend, friend.
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Post by travis on Jul 9, 2019 9:40:14 GMT -5
I pointed to Manos as an example that repositioning the SD theater seats over a new HD print is possible. Obviously the difficulty varies from episode to episode. Honestly I agree that MST3K on blu-ray is unlikely. I just think you guys are overselling how STAGGERINGLY IMPOSSIBLE it would be. There are a number of films featured in episodes that have HD masters available. It's not necessarily impossible, but it wouldn't be worth the time and effort (not even as a fan project IMO). Standard def theater silhouettes rotoscoped over 16:9 HD (keeping in mind films shot in 2.35:1 would have to be cropped) would look like crap. Plus one would have to CG extra theater seats in, and some films (like the Gamera films) have many edits/missing frames/alternate titles, etc. All of this just to still have standard-def host segments? The end result wouldn't be releasable by a company like Shout. MST3k is very much a product of the "videotape era."
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Post by majorjoe23 on Jul 9, 2019 12:54:38 GMT -5
Plus, films with film imperfections that were commented on would need to have that factored in. It seems like a giant pain.
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Post by gorncaptain on Jul 9, 2019 21:22:26 GMT -5
Worn out film prints, bad splices, missing footage, dreadful pan and scan were all part of the charm. If anything the new show is too slick and perfect in that regard. Even The Movie used a slightly worn print of This Island Earth and had a fake projector malfunction.
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Post by christmas on Jul 11, 2019 20:56:03 GMT -5
I think you're all wrong and I'm right. toodaloo, dum-dums.
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Post by ern2150 on Jul 11, 2019 21:48:26 GMT -5
I think you're all wrong and I'm right. toodaloo, dum-dums. Great
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Post by Ford Prefect on Jul 19, 2019 9:14:56 GMT -5
I think the closest we'll be getting to high definition versions of classic episodes are the "Cinema Editions" made by GaryInMotion. He posts better quality versions of the riffed movies on YouTube and syncs the riffed audio to the movie Rifftrax style. www.youtube.com/channel/UCl5WCUORYcBuUnIZ7C3pTpA
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Post by marsilies on Jul 19, 2019 9:56:22 GMT -5
Or they could use HD masters of the films and rotoscope the shadowrama into the new master. I don't think they'd have to rotoscope anything, the Best Brains archives should still have the original shadow shot that they can overlay on top of the new HD master of the film. You can see from the SciFi making of where they play with this and put some a clip of the silhouettes over different footage. www.youtube.com/watch?v=E7yqRolAlwY&t=12m9sIf the original shadow footage isn't higher resolution though, then a simple upscale could have issues, especially with Crow's webbing in his head. In the fan remast of Manos that was posted, you can see that the webbing in Crow's head is very inconsistent, often invisible, due to the low resolution. www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnxVbGZNHSsFurthermore, for HD prints a lot of the movies would be 16:9. In most cases, this would be fine, but for films where the sillohettes interact with the movie in some way it'd be an issue. And this is in addition to other factors mentioned, such as recreating the TV edits of the films used, comments about film quality possibly not being applicable to the HD print, etc. None of these are insurmountable problems, but Shout could consider it too much money and work for the projected return.
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Post by Udvarnoky on Jul 19, 2019 10:15:00 GMT -5
Logistical issues aside, the bigger argument against recreating theater segments in HD in my view is that it is revisionist, resulting in something other than what the show was when it was made. We should be watching the episode as it existed when it got submitted to the network. We should be watching the same cruddy, tape-based masters that the Brains were when they riffed them and framed the sillouettes against them. I don't think it is appropriate to revisit that.
As has been pointed out, it was not uncommon for some of the riffs to comment on print damage. Off the top of my head a number of remarks in Screaming Skull would no longer make sense if you overlaid a nice print. And as travis points out, there is literally nothing to be done with the host segments, which are locked in at standard def, so after all the effort that would go into remastering the theater segments in the way proposed (an effort which I think is being grossly underestimated, but I won't get into it), and in addition to the other concerns, you'd be left with such a distracting inconsistency so as to render it pointless.
I mean, it's a neat idea hypothetically, but I don't think it goes the distance in terms of being a worthwhile pursuit.
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