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Post by Arizona Warwilf on Jul 7, 2006 21:05:27 GMT -5
Oh . . . But aren't they wearing the funky helmets and straddling the Hobby Hogs when they say it?
I was thinking that I'd just seen it on the Poopie reel and that they never got it into the episode. I was also not thinking that they returned with the goofy helmets and Hobby Hogs. Well, I wasn't counting out the possibility that they used the line in some other place, but hadn't supposed they put the silly hats back on for it.
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Post by Arizona Warwilf on Jul 8, 2006 0:43:46 GMT -5
208 - Rock Climbing, I mean The Lost Continent!
Wow. The Mads are really evil in this one! First they revoke Joel's invention time, then give him electric shocks so he'll succumb to movie sign, and finally they give him and the bots ROCK CLIMBING!
I think this is the worst movie the show has done yet. I mean there's hokie and there's cheap, but Lost Continent is the most incompetent movie-making I've seen yet. For example, Plan 9 and Manos are truly not that bad. They're just cheap and have a tough time making good sense or having a real purpose to their stories. But Lost Continent is the bottom of the barrel when it comes to bad movies. This is the kind of movie that really has no redeeming qualities whatsoever. There is no story here. There aren't even characters! The monkey boy is as close as this movie gets to a character. What Plan 9 and Manos have going for them is that they're odd and fun to watch; in each there's a story and it's fun to watch it stumble all over itself. Lost Continent just has nothing. What I find particularly remarkable is that, though this is a "white male reality" type of film, there's no girl for the guy to get! That's the whole point of most of these things!
That said, this is a decent episode. It's not superb, but despite the excrutiating badness of the movie, Joel and the bots make it a fun time. I like the way Crow in particular freaks out in response to the numbing climbing and walking sequences ("rock climbing" may be the catch phrase, but don't discount all the walking through the jungle! Watch as the characters walk under a tree, the camera pans with them to the right, then the film cuts and shows them walking under the same exact tree!). And with as dull as this movie is ("Not since Andy Warhol's Empire State has one camera stayed in one place for so long!"), it seems like it ought to be difficult to watch, but it's not.
The host segments aren't great though. Frank's workout equipment is funny, but mostly the non-theater stuff isn't impressive.
While it's not a super duper ep, it really is impressive. I'll be thinking about it for my top five. The movie's badness is remarkable and the guys ability to make up for it is something that should be seen. But then, if there are funnier more enjoyable episodes, I'll be recommending those instead. Anyway, night night!
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Post by Cleolanta on Jul 8, 2006 1:59:24 GMT -5
I love the rock-climbing part in "Lost Continent"...I mean, the riffing of course! "They've done it! They've finally done it! They've reached the....side." "Come on, men! Just a few more feet and we'll be.....a few more feet along." "I will never let you go, I will never, ever...oh well."
"Do you think you could make that?" "Well, I don't know; I think I'd have to heat my inner core up to 4 thousand degrees, develop plate tectonics..."
(cracks up)
And of course, Joel's classic complete FREAK-OUT!! in the theater, which I still count as one of my favourite "character outbursts" of all MST time.
AND it was the origin of two famous riff patterns: "YOU look at it, I'm bitter" and "NOBODY will be seated during the climactic/dramatic/whatever SO-AND-SO scene!" The way Servo says that, is just great. The pompous, overbearing tone totally makes the line. (Also see, for a similar feel, "Please remain seated until the movie grinds to a complete halt." from a later episode...which one I won't say, 'cos you hate spoilers. ;) And I might have it wrong anyway.)
And the shock to the shammies (which is the official Joel-Era Way of Forcing You Inside the Theater...as compared to taking the oxygen out of the bridge, which is how they did it during Mike's era.)...and the prototype of all the DEEEEP HURTING! type of sequences that the Mads boast that they're going to torture the subjects with...etc. A very memorable episode, and historical to the show in several ways. Well, if you count running gags as "historical", anyway. In a comedy show...I would. :P
One of my favourite episodes, as if you couldn't tell. :)
...Notorious
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Post by jjb3k on Jul 8, 2006 16:37:37 GMT -5
When I watched "Lost Continent" for my marathon, I made sure to keep an eye out for the moment that Mike Nelson mentions in the ACEG - sure enough, when the explorers haul Sid Melton up over the cliff by his butt, Hugh Beaumont can't stop laughing.
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Post by Arizona Warwilf on Jul 10, 2006 10:03:27 GMT -5
Hey, I thought I saw him cracking up! (I don't have a copy of the ACEG, but I want one bad! I work at a used books store and I keep hoping I'll see one come into the store. I mean I found a copy of Talking Heads' What the Songs Look Like but no ACEG yet. But then, since I started working there a year ago, I've seen precious few of the shows themselves come in. I got my Collection Vol. 2 and The Brain That Wouldn't Die from work, and I've seen a total of about ten VHS eps/the movie/shorts tapes come in. Anyway . . . )
When I heard Crow say "You look at it, I'm bitter!" I couldn't think whether it was the first occurance of that line or not. That's exciting! I've always thought that was a funny line, but I've never been sure if I got it all the way. It's not a reference to anything else, is it? Is Crow saying that in response to something that has just happened on screen? I mean beside the line, "Just look at this foliage!" Is the line really situational or is it just dang funny 'cause it just is?
I also didn't realise it was the first "No one will be seated . . . " riff. I've heard those riffs so many times, I didn't realise I was hearing them for the first time, so to speak. And, Cleo, can you describe Joel's freak out, for me? I can't remember it exactly . . . I may have to sneak a rewatch of this ep just for fun (no I'm not going to inflate my "episodes watched" count that way). I previously was holding myself to the rule that I could not rewatch anything, that I just had to forge ahead and not look back. But anyway, it's looking like I'm gonna be late for work! Oops!
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Post by jjb3k on Jul 10, 2006 12:40:31 GMT -5
Hey, I thought I saw him cracking up! (I don't have a copy of the ACEG, but I want one bad! I work at a used books store and I keep hoping I'll see one come into the store. I mean I found a copy of Talking Heads' What the Songs Look Like but no ACEG yet. But then, since I started working there a year ago, I've seen precious few of the shows themselves come in. I got my Collection Vol. 2 and The Brain That Wouldn't Die from work, and I've seen a total of about ten VHS eps/the movie/shorts tapes come in. Anyway . . . ) I got my ACEG from Amazon.com, totally new and everything. If you can't find it anywhere else, I suggest you try it - it's only about $17.
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Post by Cleolanta on Jul 10, 2006 21:31:00 GMT -5
I was lucky enough to wander straight into Media Play and find it when I wanted it, but that was long ago. And now Media Play is shut down. It was one of my very favourite stores near me for a long time, and I got much cool stuff there. Books, music, movies, manga, the occasional T-shirt or game...the TV miniseries of the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy... It will be missed.
Waaaa. :(
Anyway. Back to business...as far as I _know_, that's the first occurrences of "You look at it, I'm bitter" and "NO-one will be seated..." riffs. Which may be somewhat more famous among _fan_ things than in actual other episodes, although I know they each show up at least once again, probably at least a few times. But I know that writers of text MSTings use "_You_ (do so and so), I'm bitter" and "NO-one will be seated...!" enough so that I picked it up _from there_ and started using them in my own text MSTings long before I ever got to see "Lost Continent" and realised where they were getting them from! (The riff-pattern of "Hey, WE'LL make fun of the movie/story/whatever, if you don't mind!" from way back in KTMA, is another fan favourite that I'll bet many text MSTers also don't know the true origin of. I think most of them picked it up from Megane 6.7, and haven't even _seen_ "The Million Eyes of Su-Muru"...) Anyway, my point is, after hearing/using such lines many times myself, naturally they would LEAP out at me when I first hear them in a real episode, is what I mean.
Joel's freak out...was in the theater, and it was somewhere during the rock-climbing sequence. (Which doesn't tell you much I realise as that's at least HALF THE FREAKING MOVIE! but hey...) Anyway, the bots are completely starting to lose it, and Joel keeps trying to calm them down. "Come on, guys. It's okay. We can get through this. It's okay." And then RIGHT after he tells _them_ to calm down, which of course greatly increases the humour factor, HE yells out: "What _is_ this, where ARE we, WHO are we? Can we get a frame of reference here, PLEASE?!!!"
...or something along those lines. Which causes the 'bots to first flinch sideways away from him, and then _they_ start trying to calm HIM down. It's all very sweet and touching and cathartic and silly and ironic and _scathingly_ insulting towards the movie, all at the same time...
...which is why it rules on high, of course. ;)
...Notorious
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Post by Arizona Warwilf on Jul 11, 2006 8:59:25 GMT -5
Ah yes, I remember now. That is good stuff. I probably didn't give this one enough credit for being as good as it is. I think I'm afraid to be too generous in my reviews. Like I'm holding back. I've probably got a subconscious governor that's keeping me from praising too much for fear that I'll somehow use up all my positive review commentary. No one has attacked me for it yet, but I swear, I love this show! I don't really mean to be so negative about it all. Negative is probably my impression of what a critic is. Okay, had enough neurosis? Back to it then! So I'm currently half an hour into Hellcats and have now seen the recurrence of the Hobby Hogs and silly helmets, and thusly have witnessed "I don't fink on soul brotha." So if anyone (that is, either of you) have been chomping at the bit to clarify that one for me, you can relax. I got it now.
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Post by Arizona Warwilf on Jul 12, 2006 19:59:02 GMT -5
Oh, geez! Did I say that Lost Continent was the worst movie yet? This one’s right up there! It has about as much plot. Instead of rock climbing, this time it’s “Freaking out, Joel, freaking out.” I didn’t count minutes, but I’d say that most of this film is padding, and the Brains even cut some of it! The episode is decent, but not as good as Lost Continent. In Lost Continent, they really do an impressive job in the face of the movie. Here they do a good enough job, but it’s not something to behold like in LC. I have no idea what was happening in this movie. Well, a little bit of an idea. The first cop guy was killed by . . . narcotics thugs, right? And Ross, the guy’s brother, comes in to go under cover and help his fiancée find who did it. But he hooks up with the Hellcats. Why? I don’t remember finding out how Ross knew that hanging with them would get him to the bad guys. And how did he know who was really to blame? And why did the bad guys capture Ross, Linda, and that other lady? And what did the lady who died have to do with any of it? Was I just not paying attention or could I have missed it all because you can’t understand a frickin’ word they’re saying? I’m thinking of watching the uncut version to see if that helps, but I also kind of don’t care. I might do it anyway. So this time the Mads don’t show an invention. I guess they’re even now. I wonder if they contrived all that because Joel was running low on invention ideas . . . Who knows? People with ACEGs? I guess the Mads are back on the Hobby Hogs in part because this is another biker film and also because of the mention that because the SOL crew has colds they’re having flashbacks? Am I reading that right? Early in the film there’s a shot of the quarry, and the shed in the quarry, where Sidehackers comes to its dismal end. I wonder if they shot Hackers and Cats in the same weekend! Hey, when that guy who ODs is ODing he looks a whole lot like Radar from M*A*S*H. And check out the photo of the “Artist of the Week” on the jukebox: it’s Paul Revere and The Raiders! I’m pretty sure. It’s blurry, but who else wore sky blue velvet suits with huge frilly ascots or whatever they are? The padding kind of drove me nuts. It’s gonna make me think twice about rewatching it. We’ve dealt with severe padding before (Sidehackers, Lost Continent, I’m looking at you), but there’s so much of it and so many dumb songs and maybe because of Rebels and Continent I’m done with bikers and movies stuffed with holofil. Then there’s all the little events that seem to mean nothing and come from nowhere. There’s Ross pointing at something hanging from the ceiling and drunkenly babbling about a “Silver Cyclops” (I think). It appears to be the head of a statue, but what in hellcats is it doing there? And what’s this about a Silver Cyclops? And why is any of it in the film? Then there’s the biker fight, and the “Tahiti scene” with Don Ho’s sister Heidi. What on earth is going on here?! They were right when they said, “Okay guys, great scene. It’s been a long morning, let’s break for drugs, I mean lunch.” And, as Mr. Cardoza is running around on the pier, “I bet he’s directing this while he’s running around.” Sheesh! I didn't dig the host segments. Once more the entire segment is a flashback lifted from another episode and framed with a smidge of something new. While the smidges were okay this time, there's really no worth to the flashbacks. We saw those segments already, we want new stuff. And it seems to be antithetical for the show to do this. The show is about satire and comedic theatrics. But doing a flashback show the way they do here and as they have done before doesn't satire the television establishment, it just joins on up with it. And I dislike that. These guys were great satirists and comedians and I want more of it, not rehashes. But I just wrote that paragraph after finishing a beer and it may sound too harsh. But I'm gonna play my "damn it all!" card at this point. My favorite riffs: Joel: Facial injuries are popular with these women! Crow: They’re all piano tuners! I like Crow’s joke especially ‘cause it’s the subtle one that makes the previous joke even better. I’m not sure what movie genre is my favorite when it comes to MST3K episodes, but biker movies and teensploitation are certainly not it for me. I dunno if I'm more negative than usual, but I feel like season two is starting to lag a bit. The quality of the show does feel higher as compared to last season, but I think the host segments need to improve again. They're an important part of the show since it's all them and really shows what they can do. Whoa! I got pancake sign!
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Post by jjb3k on Jul 13, 2006 1:00:18 GMT -5
I think they did hit a brief invention dry spell in Season 2 - Joel doesn't do on in 208, the Mads recycle an old one in 209 (I assume that's why they were back on the hobby hogs - I think the flashback thing was just to set up the clips in the host segments), and as you'll see in 210 and 211, the Mads don't really have anything to offer there, either. My guess is that the Brains were running out of stuff from Joel's stand-up routines and they hadn't gotten into the groove of coming up with their own funky little gadgets yet.
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Post by Arizona Warwilf on Jul 13, 2006 16:27:40 GMT -5
Folks, I've got to be honest with you. I am not feeling real enthused about the show at this point. The episodes are all okay, they're watchable and even rewatchable. I don't have a tough time getting through the episodes, but I don't feel like I'm enjoying myself much. The riffing isn't bad, not much is knocking me to the floor, but it's really not the problem, I think. It's the movies of season 2 that are really weakening me. MSTies are supposed to have thick skins when it comes to bad movies, but the plotlessness of Lippert movies and biker movies is just wearing me out. It doesn't help that the host segments have lost me. Cases in point: Joey the Lemur and The Emotional Scientist. What is going on here? Where's the funny stuff? And then there's the aforementioned invention drought.
I really want to be enjoying the show more than I am, but I can't lie to ya. My hope lies in season three which has some episodes that I know I can be excited about: Cave Dwellers, Pod People, The Master Ninjas. I don't remember how much I liked the Godzilla episodes. But some people talk about them as being great and they should be a welcome change in genre. Or subgenre.
What a terrible movie King Dinosaur is! No plot! The women are sissies! The men destroy everything! The animals have to wrestle each other and have their heads shoved in holes! (Thank you, Ralph Helfman of Nature's Haven for supervising the animals and associate producing!)
I don't know how much detail to go into here because all I have is complaints. I want to give y'all my impression of the episode, but really all I have is hate for the movie!
I can note that the term "host segment" seems to have been coined in a fan letter from "MSTies in Milwaukee". But I could be wrong, 'cause I'm often dumb. I'm assuming this 'cause the letter rates the "host segments" and Joel says, "What's a host segment?" and they pretend not to know.
I think these episodes are fine, but I'm probably just in a stinky mood. I'm having trouble convincing myself that I should be doing this. I'm not a natural born critic. I generally dislike reviews of things because I usually disagree and figure we should all just form our own opinions. So why write reviews? I don't know. I must be bitter about something, but I don't know what it is yet.
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Post by jjb3k on Jul 13, 2006 16:49:29 GMT -5
Boy, we have very different views on this episode, don't we? Personally, I think "King Dinosaur" is the best of a very funny season. Yeah, a lot of the Season 2 movies stink, but unless the movies are outright painful (as is the case with "The Sidehackers"), they tend to not drag down the episode with them. Yeah, a lot of the host segments are goofy, but to me, that's what gives them their charm. I was roaring with laughter at the ridiculousness of the Joey the Lemur bit.
Eh, to each their own, I suppose. I have a real strong affinity for awful movies, so I guess I have a higher tolerance for the cheese that the guys have to sit through. I don't let it get me down - I prefer to revel in each film's hysterical incompetence.
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Post by Arizona Warwilf on Jul 13, 2006 16:55:25 GMT -5
So, why don't MSTies seem to hate Robert Lippert as much as say Sandy Frank? He brought us Rocketship X-M, Jungle Goddess, Lost Continent and King Dinosaur (and that's just season 2!).
I kind of feel like I know what directors do and so I can understand blaming Coleman Francis directly for the creation of his films. But I don't really know what executive producers do; can they be blamed for the awfulness of a movie? There are significant parallels running through the four MSTed Lippert movies, so that's a case for blaming him for these pieces of painful film. But I think Sandy Frank gets picked on more than he deserves. Sure, my impression of him is that he wanted to make money off of cheap crap, but what else did he do but transplant already awful stuff to a different place? He didn't have anything to do with creating the stuff. Why is he so hated?
My argument is this: Robert Lippert should be hated more than Sandy Frank.
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Post by Arizona Warwilf on Jul 13, 2006 17:01:02 GMT -5
Oops, I was typing the above post when you posted, jjb.
Heck I dunno. I think I'm in a depressive rut again. I really love this show but I'm not feeling into it at all. Now that I think of it, that's a major symptom of depression: you're suddenly not interested in things you usually like. So, I guess we can blame that.
I should probably just take a break and get back to it when I feel better. But then I don't want to feel like I'm quitting. I just fear that I'd never get back to it.
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Post by Cleolanta on Jul 13, 2006 22:38:43 GMT -5
Actually I'm kinda with you on the "Lippert should be hated more than Frank", BUT...for the most part, I'm more with jjb3k on these. To me, these movies/episodes are not that painful. No matter how slow or dated they are (with the exception of when they get _too_ sexist/racist, to where it stands out, in my mind, even for their time), the old-fashioned black and white sci-fi movies from the '50s have this warm, fuzzy, comfortable quality for me. No, it's not nostalgia, I'm nowhere near THAT old :P but they just seem like...I don't know. Like what MST3K Should Be. When I think of people doing Turkey Movie Night in their own homes, before MST came along, I think of them doing it to things such as Plan 9 from Outer Space and Robot Monster. Cheesy black-and-white flicks just feel like the most..._right_ genre for MST3K, to me. The others can be made fun of too, but this is it, this is the REAL type. Right here. The true, _classic_, type of Cheesy Movie.
Putting that aside, I happen to love the riffs in King Dinosaur, Rocketship X-M, and Lost Continent (especially during the short, with King Dinosaur...that cracks me _up_!) and the somewhat ineptness of the host segments doesn't bother me, except for when they recycle (I'm with you on that, Azwarwilf). The kind of clutzy low-budget goofiness is part of the "warm, fuzzy" charm that the Joel era in general has, and part of why I like these episodes. They won't shock me or jolt me or gross me out--they're my MST _comfort_ food.
And I swear, I actually do like the riffs in these movies. They make me laugh. It's not JUST the "mood", really. The ones that drag _me_ down tend to be the cheesy-disgusting-annoying-sleazy '70s TV "movies" and '80s ones. Which is odd, 'cos I like _other_ aspects of the '80s. Can't get enough of the music, for example, and some of the fashions (I think the longer, fluffier hairstyles guys had back then made them look _so_ much more attractive). '80s attitudes in a _good_ movie aren't as annoying, but put that bratty, juvenille, frat-boy "Dur hur hur, let's be dirty just because we CAN, hur hur!" mentality with _bad_ writing...and both things' badness are greatly enhanced by each other. I'm not fond of biker-movies, either, and the '60s spy genre on MST just leaves me cold. I like the original Avengers, and the Sean Connery James Bond movies. Other than that, I don't care much for the whole category--even the _well_-made, high budget examples.
Anyway, back to the episodes... Hellcats had some riffs in it from the last time I watched it, that made me crack up for some reason (I can't remember them now!--but it had to do with talking back to the music, trying to do parts of a song but being cut off, and annoying each _other_ and telling each other to shut up) and the bad guys tying Rommel's _knees_ to the chair. What the HECK?! That just made me fall over, it's so absurd. "Oh, no, they've heard about your knees, Rommel!"
Or: "THRILL as Rommel tries--and fails--to find the entrance!"
Anyway. I hope you enjoy Season 3 more...personally, I _love_ most of the Sandy Frank episodes, and if you say bad things about (episode-wise, not the movies) Fugitive Alien 2, Gamera Vs. Guiron or Gamera Vs. Zigra I may be forced to injure you. Just a little. ;) No, just kidding, but really, Season 3 is full of SO much great stuff. You'll probably bog down at the ones that are among my favourites ever--the Roger Corman epics!--I'm _expecting_ you to not like "It Conquered the World" and "Viking Women and the Sea Serpent", even though I love them to death. But it'll be interesting to see what you think of the Sandy Frank ones. Those could go either way...
As for giving up? Well, I do think that one should be allowed to take breaks; burning out on anything is bad, and burning out on one of your _favourite_ things is something that should, if possible, NEVER happen. (And some board members here think it's odd that I can only watch an episode once and be done with it for months; where they can watch it "every day" or several times in a row and not get tired of it. I have a low "burn out" factor, a small appetite...it fills up fast!)
But you should not give up entirely. Break yes, but give up, no. I ran into many movies along this way that were SEVERELY painful for me, but I perservered! Did I give up when Mighty Jack (both versions) literally made me fall asleep? No! Did I give up when Ring of Terror depressed and claustrophobed me? No! Did I turn tail and run away from the _triple_ threat at the end of Season 3 of the two boring, sleazy, utterly confusing Master Ninja "movies" AND Castle of Fu Manchu, which is in my opinion _the_ most unwatchable MST movie EVER? No! Did the incredibly disgusting, offensive, sexist, _loathsome_ Zombie Nightmare make me run away? NO!
...if I can survive all of those, trust me, _you_ can survive your least favourite episodes, too. I mean, come on--I'm a total wimp! And _I_ didn't give up. If I, a complete and utter wimp with an _insanely_ low pain threshhold, didn't give up, then you should _certainly_ be able to make it through all the movies.
:)
...Notorious
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