TomServo69
Moderator Emeritus
Gone but not Forgotten
Nothing ever changes........
Posts: 5,467
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Post by TomServo69 on Jul 4, 2005 23:01:03 GMT -5
God, here we go again.
Servo
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Post by vanhagar3000 on Jul 4, 2005 23:05:55 GMT -5
No, you did booger! Citizen Kane just had everything. Great (not the mention revolutionary) direction, a great story, great acting, and great dialouge. It's thirlling and compeling. 2001 is....2001.
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TomServo69
Moderator Emeritus
Gone but not Forgotten
Nothing ever changes........
Posts: 5,467
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Post by TomServo69 on Jul 4, 2005 23:06:39 GMT -5
Well, you guys go ahead and have your little pissing contest.
I voted for 2001 anyways!
Servo
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Post by vanhagar3000 on Jul 4, 2005 23:11:11 GMT -5
I think you're taking me the wrong way Forrest. We know we have opposite opinions on 2001. Why do we keep opening threads? We know things aren't going to change soon. So we rib each other about it.
Let's start agreeing again. Remember that? A Clockwork Orange is a terrific movie!
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Post by vanhagar3000 on Jul 4, 2005 23:14:55 GMT -5
Anyway that's it. VH hasn't even seen 2001 all the way through Oh boy, that arguement. I'm sorry Forrest, but I've seen enough of 2001 to know that if the rest of it was a really good movie, that it couldn't make up for the rest. BTW, I do want to say, the first act of the movie is terrific. But after that it loses me.
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Post by vanhagar3000 on Jul 4, 2005 23:23:50 GMT -5
Honestly Forrest, it's been a while. I gave that movie a chance, but I need to give some more movies chances too. I'm sure I'll get back to it sometime.
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Post by Mr. Atari on Jul 4, 2005 23:46:36 GMT -5
These two are often called the greatest film of all time. Really? By whom? I've heard Kane described that way. Sometimes Casablanca. But I don't think I've "often" heard anyone put 2001 in that category. But since I'm forced to choose...hmmm.... Both are clever, artistic, and great discussion pieces. Works of art, really. One annoys the Hades out of me and the other bores me to tears. How can I pick? Okay, I'll pick Kane. It lived up to the hype a bit more for me.
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Post by Shep on Jul 5, 2005 7:55:20 GMT -5
2001
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Post by ratso on Jul 5, 2005 15:16:07 GMT -5
Most of the time I would always, always go with 2001... But I have really started to warm up to Citizen Kane. I just like the whole look of that movie, It's dark and somewhat eerie and just different. But 2001 can be dark, and joyful at times and show more emotions than Citizen Kane. So I really don't know yet.
What it comes down to is I'm a sucker for camera angles. I believe that camera angles make the movie. So you got a movie like Citizen Kane which has arguably some of the best camera work ever made... and you got a movie like 2001 which also has phenomenal camera work so I find it very hard to decide... I don't really care that much for the rest of Orson Wells work, I consider him the inferior filmaker out of the two. I think Kubrick was a genius and made movies that were almost larger than life. He could take crap and turn it into gold IMO. It seems that the only way I'm going to make up my mind is if I go back and watch them again so that's what I plan to do.
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Post by Mr. Atari on Jul 5, 2005 22:14:30 GMT -5
And in my mind, at least, Casablanca, Gone With The Wind and Citizen Kane are child's play next to 2001. I'm not a big fan of Gone With the Wind, and you know my feelings about Kane. But Casablanca is like the photo negative of 2001. While 2001 is sterile, slow, immaculately photographed and philosophical, Casablanca is emotional, quick-witted, grimy, and romantic. In 2001, the humans (and actors) are essentially set dressing and inconsequential; Casablanca has some of the best acting in the history of film. In 2001, most of the dialogue is sparse and forgettable*; in Casablanca, every line counts and is memorable. In 2001, the theme is all about what's outside of humanity; in Casablanca, the theme is all about what's inside a man and how he deals with it. I'm sorry, but given the choice between unemotional, sterile philosophy and emotive relational humanity, I'll take Casablanca every time. * I said "most" of the dialogue. Of course, "Open the pod bay doors, Hal" and "I can't do that, Dave" are classics. But other than those lines, what's really memorable about the writing or the acting in that film?
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Post by Mr. Atari on Jul 6, 2005 0:24:25 GMT -5
I don't disagree. In fact, everything you just said about 2001 reinforces my point. Casablanca is exactly the opposite of all that. It's gutteral, romantic, emotional, and whatever the opposite of "dehumanizing" is (humanizing?).
And it's not just a sappy love story. It's a war movie. The national anthem battle is one of cinema's greatest scenes. The whole plot revolves around the Germans, the Resistance, and the real threat of concentration camps.
It's also a study in humanity. Rick is a selfish coward who doesn't "stick his neck out for nobody." When Ilsa shows up, he is forced into a deeper depression, until he starts thinking about someone other than himself. It's about risking everything to do the right thing- even dying to something deep down inside for the sake of something greater than yourself. Rick's sacrifice at the end isn't merely sappy or hearbreaking, it's heroic.
It's also a brilliant film noir. Rick plays every side against the others in order to get what he wants. And, of course, as in all good film noir, no one--not even the audience-- knows what he's really up to. All set against terrific lighting, ambiance and shadows.
Oh yeah, it's also a great love story. One of the best ever written. It doesn't have a happy ending, but it doesn't have a tragic ending either. It has a noble ending- the best part of a love story.
And it has about 200 classic, memorable lines.
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Post by Merlin on Jul 7, 2005 22:19:32 GMT -5
Kubrick is the better filmmaker, and Kane is the better film. Welles wasn't quite as great as he liked to think, but Citizen Kane is revolutionary in so many ways, and helped to provide the foundation that Kubrick built upon.
In my humble opinion, that is.
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Post by vanhagar3000 on Jul 8, 2005 0:32:46 GMT -5
noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo lol You asked for it (literally) ;D
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Post by vanhagar3000 on Jul 8, 2005 2:57:53 GMT -5
Well only 9 votes, and over a thousand members? In the words of Barry Lyndon: "Let those that laugh - win." Does that make Krankor a winner?
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Post by tomservo92 on Sept 15, 2005 22:46:49 GMT -5
2001 was much better than Citizen Kane
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