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Post by Emperor Cupcake on Apr 9, 2012 17:22:53 GMT -5
I'm usually very leery of trying to turn people on to MST3K, since it's so near and dear to me that I feel like I would have to violently assault a friend who couldn't get into it. When I was married, I often tried to get my ex-husband to watch it with me, and sometimes he would, but he's British and fairly humorless, so a lot of the riffs (and the humor) were completely lost on him.
My boyfriend now had actually seen some episodes of the show and liked them before I met him...he's not a huge fan, but he likes to watch it sometimes if the mood strikes, especially the Gamera films because he loves Japanese monster movies. But he still tends to get distracted by how terrible the movies are and sometimes has a hard time sitting through them. We were watching Soultaker last night, and for the first half he was like, "Oh man, this movie sucks so bad..." but when it got to the part with Brad as the Soultaker ("Was Sabbath wrong too, man???" and the Peter Frampton riffs) he was laughing so hard he was crying. So I seem to have taken a definite step up in my choice of mates. :-D
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Post by Hellcat on Apr 9, 2012 23:58:53 GMT -5
Wait until your friend is bedridden with the flu, then wheel in the TV and a bunch of the discs, where they can do nothing but lay there and watch. That's how you get'em! (:-P) That is a diabolical plot worthy of Dr. Forrester himself! ;D Seriously, though, I appreciate everyone's comments. It looks as though people have had a variety of experiences in trying to share the goodness of MST3K. I guess a lot depends on how receptive the audience is, as Emperor Cupcake's story demonstrates. In my case my friend assured me that she liked bad movies, and she told me about a lousy movie that she had seen and enjoyed. I had recently seen the same picture, and I thought that it gave me a reasonably good grasp of what she might like in an episode. I took a shot and it didn't pan out. The jury is still out as to whether I'll try it again. In the meantime, at least I still have the Brooklyn MST3K/Rifftrax Meetup Group. It doesn't meet as often as I would like, but at least I get a chance to hang out with other fans.
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Post by PimPamPet on Apr 10, 2012 0:53:25 GMT -5
I think probably the best way to introduce people to MST3K is to show them The Movie. It's short, the movie (This Island Earth) is accessible and lots of fun, plus everything that one needs to know about the characters is explained in the prologue. That's how I introduced MST to my sister, anyway (who now is almost as big a MSTie as I am).
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Post by oldmanmerton on May 25, 2012 23:37:25 GMT -5
I've found it very difficult to introduce people to MST. There's no gray area with liking or disliking the show as far as I'm concerned. I'm fortunate in that my wife enjoys it (it helped that she felt special having seen KTMA episodes as a kid growing up in the Midwest while I hadn't) and that my best friend does as well.
The best results I ever had introducing people to the show was when I lived in Edinburgh. My wife was part of the film studies department at the University there and we were involved in all sorts of film clubs, so we started up an MST3k club. And well, if you provide wine at a gathering in the UK, you're pretty much guaranteed for it to be somewhat of a success. Being that a lot of the folks attending were film school snobs, the individual reaction varied from loathing to unadulterated joy, but the people that liked it continued to come. It also helped that the entire thing seemed incredibly strange and exotic to a lot of them.
But yeah, I really don't bother trying to introduce the show to people nowadays. In my 30s, I find most of the people I know just don't possess anything resembling the sense of humor you need to enjoy the show. :-(
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Post by fathermushroom on May 27, 2012 19:06:50 GMT -5
I used to write and record songs, and remember distinctly the difference between friends who would listen to a new song, and friends who would immediately start a conversation while I was playing them the song.
Some people simply don't know what "listening" to something means to the rest of us.
Anyway, to address your question -- I've had very patchy success with introducing people to MST3K. It either clicks right away or they're just not interested enough to get mentally into it.
The friends I got into it, are all "fair weather" MSTies who enjoy it if I suggest it, but never ask to see more on their own. That's good enough. And they were all the sort of people who liked the same comedians, music, etc. as I do anyway. Or at least enjoyed a very broad range of artistic experiences.
Very hit-or-miss.
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Post by Emperor Cupcake on May 28, 2012 11:22:33 GMT -5
Yeah, I've found that people either like it or they don't, which is why, as I mentioned before, that I'm always apprehensive about introducing people to it that have never seen it. I mean, I took to the show immediately, during one of CC's first Turkey Day marathons...I was flipping through the channels at my grandmother's house before the food was ready, and I stopped on Santa Claus Conquers the Martians, went, "Wha...?" then ended up sitting there watching episode after episode, all day long. Even brought my Thanksgiving dinner into the bedroom with me so I didn't miss anything. So I feel like if people don't immediately take to it, then probably they never will. But maybe that's just my experience; perhaps it takes time for the show to grow on some people.
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Post by angilasman on May 28, 2012 21:18:01 GMT -5
Of course, some people just won't like the show - but for the best possible into I'm quite sure the best entry point is the shorts: they're the most consistently (very) funny thing in the history of the show and they're bite size. They don't requiring the amount of time it takes to watch an episode the length of a feature film! The reward the most pleasure per short amount of time and watching a few of them eases the newbie into the dynamic of the show. They get a sense of how everything works.
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Post by oldmanmerton on May 28, 2012 21:47:35 GMT -5
Of course, some people just won't like the show - but for the best possible into I'm quite sure the best entry point is the shorts: they're the most consistently (very) funny thing in the history of the show and they're bite size. They don't requiring the amount of time it takes to watch an episode the length of a feature film! The reward the most pleasure per short amount of time and watching a few of them eases the newbie into the dynamic of the show. They get a since of how everything works. Yeah the shorts and the movie seem to be the best bet for introducing someone. Although as much as we as fans might love the non-theater segments of the movie (or any episode for that matter) they can be huge turnoffs for anyone new that might seem them as too silly. Though it's hardly science and mostly just my attempt to pretend to catch lightning in a bottle, that's part of how I'm tackling each episode in my journal. Rate the pain of the film, the quality of cheese, and the overall (riffs+host segments) to try to find those BEST matchups of low pain but outstanding riff material + best work by the guys on the show. Of course when all is said and done and I've finished the entire series I'm not sure if it will actually play out that way. I think there's frequently a correlation between high pain/bad cheese and high overall rating because those are the movies that tested the writers the most and they quite often stepped up to the plate and delivered (Eegah being the prime example of the ones I've reviewed so far). Still...I'm curious if there is some sort of sweet spot. Like...6 or 7 on the pain scale, really good cheese (fantasy or terrible action movie maybe), and top notch riffing. In the end it's probably all just a crap shoot. I became addicted to the show on my first episode (Jungle Goddess) and that is a C+ episode imo.
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Post by wedestroymyths on May 29, 2012 1:57:44 GMT -5
I've had good luck at the university where I'm currently studying, granted, we also had good luck, here, finding people who love playing board games likes Settlers of Catan and Agricoloa. The overlap is not surprising.
Basically, our screen studies friends really dig the show, and one prof who is no longer here actually showed us some shorts in a course about failure (no joke, we also watched The Room in that class, and talked a lot about "double deception," "the uncanny valley," and lo-fi aesthetics).
Still, I've found the shorts go over very well, and that sci fi period episodes tend to work best for groups of people who like, but don't necessarily love the show. Second best are CC era Mike episodes. There's something about the style of riffing once Mike takes over, especially into the sci fi era that makes for better group viewing--the riffing is a little tighter, punchier, and accessible. I've always enjoyed Joel eps more, but the only Joel eps that have gone over well are "Santa Claus Conquers the Martins," "Time of the Apes," "Operation Double 007," and "Manos." For Mike, I've had success with "Santa Claus," "Alien from L.A." "Village of the Giants," "Zombie Nightmare," "The Incredible Melting Man," "Laserblast," "The Giant Spider Invasion," "Space Mutiny," "The Puma Man," "Werewolf," "The Touch of Satan," "The Final Sacrifice," and "Squirm."
Episodes that didn't go over include "Gamera vs. Guiron" (!!!!!!), "Rocketship XM," "The Giant Leeches," and "I Was a Teenage Werewolf," among others.
Huh...looking at this list now, I'm struck by two things 1. Apparently less avid fans I know prefer color episodes, and 2. I've hosted a ton of MST nights in the last 4 years.
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Post by caucasoididiot on May 29, 2012 9:27:54 GMT -5
My experience matches a lot of what people have already said. When someone is new to the show and unfamiliar with the concept, there's a natural tendency to try to watch the film itself, thus it had better not be an actual turn-off. Color eps that at least have decent production values and no actually cringe-worthy moments are thus a safer bet (Cave Dwellers bats highest in my own experience). Of course, if you know your audience and can pick an experiment that'll be an easy fit for them (like Gamera to a kaijuu fan), so much the better.
I remember one two-strike failure when I took Santa Claus Conquers the Martians to a group movie night around the holidays. With such a non-entry level, goddawful kids' movie and three people totally new to the show, it rapidly became background noise to conversation.
I've never tried the shorts, but they do seem a good idea. "Bite-sized" as angilasman put it, and something that people don't go into expecting to particularly be entertained by.
The Movie was, I think, somewhat consciously viewed as introductory by The Brains, though personally I think the lone Dr. Forrester is something of a hole in it. My one attempt with it wasn't too successful, but neither was it a vert typical case. Finding a subtitled copy in a Japanese used video store, I eagerly took it home to show my Japanese wife, but it only got a single laugh out of her. C'est la vie.
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Post by oldmanmerton on May 29, 2012 14:40:07 GMT -5
I tried to do Santa Claus Conquers during a Christmas marathon too and it didn't quite go over as I wanted. Which wounds me as I have such fond nostalgia for that episode and the first time I watched it right before Christmas.
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Post by BJ on May 29, 2012 15:01:52 GMT -5
One way I've gotten people to like the show is to email them clips that cater to their own interests. For instance, in one of the swamp episodes, there's a joke about the Bubble Room on Captiva island. My family has vacationed there many times, so I sent just that bit to my parents who got a laugh out of it.
The next Thanksgiving, I was with the family and managed to get sick, so I sat around all afternoon watching Night of the Blood Beast and the XMas episodes. At various times, other people were in the family room laughing along. They're not going to become huge fans, but they also won't complain if I'm watching the show on the big tv.
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Post by angilasman on May 29, 2012 15:41:18 GMT -5
I agree with what's been said. Although I think the shorts are the best bet, the next step, a full episode, should be judged with the combination of "is the movie somewhat entertaining (thus fairly painless) on its own?" and "is the film of a genre the person is already interested in?"
A few years ago my bio professor (a MST fan) said that her son serving in Iraq watched the Samson vs. The Vampire Women episode over there with a bunch of fellow servicemen who had never seen the show before but happened to be Mexican - they loved it!
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Post by Mitchell on May 29, 2012 16:57:54 GMT -5
I think you need three things to "get" MST3K; and I think that's why MST3K is so beloved by its fans: not many other forms of comedy cater to those three things.
They are:
1) a sarcastic sense of humor; let's face it, we're laughing AT people
2) a deep knowledge of--coupled with a general disdain for--pop culture, and
3) an age relatively close to The Brains: Gen Xers and some early Gen Yers. Older is probably fine, though, too.
Why number three? Most of the riffs are centered on references from that time frame, based on things that influenced each Brain in some way. It might be too much to ask a Millennial, for instance, to get why the "SNAP INTO A SLIM JIM!" riff from Boggy Creek II is funny.
If any of those three aspects are missing, I think the show doesn't click. It's just people throwing non-sequiturs towards an unwatchable movie.
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Post by gargonshepard on May 30, 2012 18:26:49 GMT -5
I have had no success introducing people to MST3K. My dad watched bits and pieces and laughed robustly. So I let him borrow Rifftrax "Night of the living dead" thinking he loves that movie and seemed to get the humor. BAD MOVE! He said it wasn't one bit funny and now refuses to watch anything related. I've come to the conclusion if it hits you, your hooked bad and become instant a rabid fan. If not you hate it. My first episode was Manos and I immediately looked for a box set to buy. I showed my wife and she was not amused. I'm pretty much resigned to watching after my wife falls asleep early.
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