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Post by SoCalChevy on Dec 22, 2015 13:28:55 GMT -5
So in an interview posted on satellite news Joel said they're going to start working on the show January 4th!
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Post by jaybird3rd on Dec 22, 2015 15:51:14 GMT -5
Trace seems overly bitter about the whole thing, it's interesting in contrast how while the Rifftrax guys while maybe not actively taking a part have been overly supportive, even going as far as helping contribute to one of the bonus rewards. I find it ironic as unlike Trace, Frank and Josh who have been nothing passive aggressive about the revival, the Rifftrax crew stuck with the show to the very end. At least we know Paul Chaplin is back as part of the writing team. I really wish that the fans would stop pestering them about the new MST3K. After having to address the same painful questions over and over again, I almost can't blame them for getting a bit cranky. Having said that, however, all the passive-aggressive stuff is really getting annoying. I don't intend any disrespect to anyone involved, but I don't think they're being rational about this, and I'm done letting their collective attitude problem cast a shadow over what Joel is doing with the show. Joel's public demeanor has been unfailingly gracious and classy since the campaign started; I've followed it closely, and I've never heard him say a bad word about anyone. The public demeanor of certain other people ... has not been so gracious. If it's true that they're too busy to get involved with the new show because they've moved on to bigger and better things, then why all the grousing about being "excluded" from it? And if they're NOT too busy and WOULD like to have been involved, then why have they reportedly declined the offers they've received? I love you guys, but make up your minds, will ya?! Either spell out exactly what's bothering you and get it out of your systems once and for all, or if you can't (or won't) discuss it publicly, then have fun keeping busy with all the other cool projects you're involved with and just maintain radio silence about the new MST3K for everyone's sake, because these passive-aggressive remarks aren't helping the situation. People just end up quoting them in a breathless "can you believe what so-and-so just said about the new MST3K?!" manner, and every time that happens, it's like a trickle of vinegar into the milk of the new show. How can that accomplish anything positive?
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Post by slainmonkey on Dec 22, 2015 16:50:51 GMT -5
Well while I can't agree with harrassing them over it, I can't say that Trace, Frank and Josh have painted themselves in a very good light. While I'll never deny they are talented people I have lost a lot of respect for all of them for their childish teen drama nonsense......I mean their middle aged men for crying out loud. My guess as to what it's all about is that they are antsy about the end of Cinematic Titanic and because Joel feels the new MST3K also needs some fresh talent for a new era, they didn't like the notion of taking up a smaller role on it. If that offer wasn't appealing to them then honestly nothing is stopping them from joining up and doing their own riffing project independently of Joel.....oh wait, 2 of them currently are as The Mads which shows they don't mind cashing in on the MST3K brand when it suits their interests. Unless Joel did something incredibly unspeakably horrible behind closed doors, then it's all just really petty.......and if he did I doubt Paul Chaplin would be back and I doubt Rifftrax would have shown the new MST3K support they have.
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Post by jaybird3rd on Dec 22, 2015 18:56:32 GMT -5
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Post by starschwar on Dec 22, 2015 22:01:58 GMT -5
I'm disappointed by the passive aggressiveness exhibited as well. Now, we don't know the whole story - and probably never will. So I'll give the former CT members benefit of the doubt - they could be fully justified in feeling the way they do. But by leaving us out of the loop, they really aren't presenting themselves in the best light. Joel's public persona has been a complete class act, acknowledging both Rifftrax, as well as The Mads, openly offering cameos and the like to everybody. Tons of Mike era episodes in the stream a-thon. Even referencing him by name in the Kickstarter-closing theme song sing a long. I get the impression that he really does love the show, even the parts he wasn't there there for, and the people who made it possible. So it's really disheartening to me to recognize that some sort of rift is forming between some of the former cast members. Together, they brought us so much happiness, so much laughter. This kind of drama is just.... out of character, you know?
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Post by cabinboy9000 on Dec 22, 2015 22:17:17 GMT -5
I also find the passive aggressiveness disappointing and strange. I may be hallucinating but I do seem to remember a recent interview where Trace notes that he received an offer to be part of the reboot that was financially generous, and if that's the case, then the rift does not seem to related to money.
Based on some of Frank and Josh's tweets regarding ageism the only thing I can guess is the trio (Trace, Josh, and Frank) were offered positions that were primarily behind the scenes with occasional on-screen appearances, while possibly all three wanted to return to their old characters full-time. This is just a guess and I may be completely wrong, but it's all I can surmise based on a variety of tweets.
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Post by angilasman on Dec 22, 2015 23:12:21 GMT -5
I get the feeling from Joel that he feels the show is his legacy and he wants it to be some kind of 'forever franchise' that can outlast him... or something like that.
I think that's probably quite a different relationship with the property than the rest of the Brains have.
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Post by chudnado on Dec 23, 2015 0:11:04 GMT -5
I have to admit, I was hoping more of the old crew would be down for being a part of the new show. Hasn't made me any less excited to have MST back, I'm sure the new gang will do great, but this divide is a little depressing.
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Post by someoneinatree on Dec 23, 2015 0:20:42 GMT -5
In the Wired! oral history, Jim Mallon said that one of the points of tension leading to Joel's departure from the show was that, at least to Mallon's point of view, was that Joel viewed MST3K as his show, not so much a team product. Trace and Josh were there from the beginning, building the show into what we love, in some cases quite literally. My feeling is that the original cast feels slighted. Furthermore, it sounds like a few of them weren't even aware of the Kickstarter being launched and had to endure a month of being asked the same questions. Anyone here remember the Satellite News interview with Jim Mallon? In it, he confirmed that Joel approached him to do new episodes for the show's 20th anniversary. Mallon said that a bunch of logistical things prevented the project from going forward, including who would play what character given all the recastings. Maybe that stuck with Joel and he figured the only way to prevent hurt feelings was to go entirely new.
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Post by BoB3K on Dec 23, 2015 1:06:22 GMT -5
That was a good article with Joel on Rolling Stone. It's kind of odd that I had to find out about it through side channels, and not through kickstarter updates. So, production starts January 14th, but new eps not out out until fall. It will be very interesting to see if we are seeing commercials for this new season on some cable or internet channel by the time it's ready to air.
I really like Joel's description of how the new show will be produced like the old show--in camera, 'almost live'. I also wish some of the old cast had come along, but it looks like that boat has sold, and I'm movin' on.
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Post by slainmonkey on Dec 23, 2015 1:36:10 GMT -5
I get the feeling from Joel that he feels the show is his legacy and he wants it to be some kind of 'forever franchise' that can outlast him... or something like that. I think that's probably quite a different relationship with the property than the rest of the Brains have. That's pretty much what he said during the Kickstarter that he feels it's something that could continue on indefinitely, he also seemed to be inspired to bring it back based on all the people the show has inspired over the years, people who have even gone on to lead successful careers of their own. Honestly Trace, Frank and Josh (seriously though, this guy left after season 1) have all been very petty about it no matter what way you slice it, it's kinda been an insult not just to Joel but everyone who backed it and everyone who will be part of the show's future.
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Post by starschwar on Dec 23, 2015 2:26:15 GMT -5
Though, there is an important distinction to be made when it comes to Josh, Trace and Frank, versus Kevin, Bill and Mike. The former three all left of their own volition. For their own various reasons, they'd had their fill of MST3K and moved on back in the day. I can see why they wouldn't want to come back after the fact, but surely that can't be the only reason. Can it? The later three were just forced into retirement when the show was cancelled. And in a way, they fought back and got Rifftrax off the ground, reviving the core concept. I can see why they'd prefer to focus their energies on their own baby, for lack of a better term, while offering some support to the revival. Again, broad strokes here. Just idle speculation, really.
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Post by slainmonkey on Dec 23, 2015 4:06:58 GMT -5
Though, there is an important distinction to be made when it comes to Josh, Trace and Frank, versus Kevin, Bill and Mike. The former three all left of their own volition. For their own various reasons, they'd had their fill of MST3K and moved on back in the day. I can see why they wouldn't want to come back after the fact, but surely that can't be the only reason. Can it? The later three were just forced into retirement when the show was cancelled. And in a way, they fought back and got Rifftrax off the ground, reviving the core concept. I can see why they'd prefer to focus their energies on their own baby, for lack of a better term, while offering some support to the revival. Again, broad strokes here. Just idle speculation, really. It's not the fact they aren't returning that raises eyebrows, it's the petty passive aggressive highschool drama nonsense that Trace, Frank and Josh have taken part in since the the start of the campaign that does. As you pointed Mike, Bill and Kevin were more or less unceremoniously forced into retirement when the show was canceled, however while not involved with it (at least as far as I know) they have been supportive of the new MST3K and even going as far as adding a Rifftrax short as part of the rewards for pledging. As it follows Trace, Frank and Josh's attitude seems to have something to do with Cinematic Titanic, if it were just a case of wanting to move on I don't see why they'd be that nasty about it.
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Post by mylungswereaching on Dec 23, 2015 11:35:20 GMT -5
The Rifftrax attitude makes a lot of sense. Mst3k ended 15 years ago. They have created their own business that they are happy with. They support MST3k because it is a good business decision which could result in more sales for Rifftrax and it makes their mutual fans happier.
The quotes I've seen from Josh seem more like kidding around than bitter. I'd guess he liked CT and is annoyed that it ended too soon but isn't overly angry about it. I also haven't seen that much bitterness from Frank. It really only Trace that has been overly petty about the whole thing. I find it strange because he quit MST3k. If any of the old crew should be crow it would be Bill. (Although I prefer Trace to Bill, Bill didn't quit, he was forced out.)
I can only guess that Trace feels that some promise was broken or he was hurt financially from CT.
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Post by SoCalChevy on Dec 23, 2015 15:06:10 GMT -5
Got the email with a code to redeem for a classic episode!
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