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Post by starsteam on Feb 24, 2017 10:17:45 GMT -5
So no "keep circulating the tapes" mentality here. I was surprised how fast the two lost KTMA episodes went up for torrenting.
My internet is pretty bad so I can only get Netflix at barely watchable quality- but I'll sit through all 14 episodes in 120p to support it if I have to. Though I'll probably be clicking that cancel button as soon as I've finished them.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 11:04:07 GMT -5
I'm one of the backers getting the digital copies and if you ask me I'm the least likely person to leak something out, though I can understand the concern here.
To be honest, from the handful of film/TV projects I backed on Kickstarter I haven't seen any backer try and put the digital copies on torrent sites, or even care for that mater, and a few of them were hosted on VHX. If that happened, I'd probably know about it. Beyond that, some creators get furious when their work gets pirated and some don't mind as long as they don't lose any more revenue. It's a complex topic and there isn't any middle ground when you dig deep into it. But with the practice of torrenting becoming riskier and more difficult, there shouldn't be that much to worry about as long as everyone plays nice.
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Torgo
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Post by Torgo on Feb 24, 2017 11:31:15 GMT -5
"Keep Circulating the Tapes" is a bit of an old fashioned ideology. When Best Brains encouraged people to do this it was when they are on fairly young cable channels that had small ratings and no merchandise, and "circulating the tapes" was a way of spreading the word and building hype. Now a large amount of the episodes are on DVD and streaming and supporting the show as it relaunches is the only way to ensure it's survival as a franchise. Circumstances are completely different.
Bot those who pirate are a tricky bunch to get through to. I remember reading a back and forth with someone who solely bootlegged by saying "pirating isn't stealing, it's merely cloning something that still exists" and refused to see how companies lose money from what he does, which is asinine. Another incident I read had someone justifying seeing a movie for free with "are you saying if you saw a laptop on a park bench, you wouldn't take it?" These people don't see themselves as thieves.
Bootlegs are handy when something isn't commercially available, so I'm not entirely against it, but this isn't the time for it. It's time to suck up your pride, sign up for that fairly cheap account, and stream over and over again.
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Post by Mod City on Feb 24, 2017 13:21:31 GMT -5
As much as I'd like to agree that MST fans are loyal and wouldn't spread stuff around that they were asked not to, I'm afraid MST3K fans seem pretty much the same as any other internet dweller when it comes to posting stuff they shouldn't. Joel already called us out on it in a Kickstarter update.
Personally, I don't care how long I have to wait for that stuff. If they're trigger shy about releasing those digital downloads prior to the new season on Netflix, well, so be it, as far as I'm concerned.
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Post by BilLumberg on Feb 24, 2017 13:29:57 GMT -5
It is common for netflix originals to be copied and torrented from the netflix stream. Hopefully when MST3K torrents appear they will be sourced from the streaming and not from the backer copies. But I bet the backer copies will be easier for them to work with. The people that put out torrents probably won't even need to be backers to get access the digital releases.
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Post by Afgncaap5 on Feb 25, 2017 4:16:03 GMT -5
Yeah. "Keep Circulating The Tapes" was a great credo in the early 90s when cable TV was limited, the show couldn't lose money, and when the fastest a copy could get to someone else was the speed of driving the car with the copy to your friend's house. A button-click to transfer brand new episodes to hundreds of people in a way that can lose money for the show is a different story. I agree that it's definitely a complex issue (and I'm not saying that MSTies don't have a few pirates among them who feel that circulating the tapes is a tradition that should be maintained even today) but I do think that the Kickstarter doners are less likely to do things that might make a 12th season harder to come by.
In fact, the ones who'll torrent Netflix are pretty much exactly why I'll be reactivating my old account instead of just using my friend's Netflix account like I always do.
This topic actually came up two years ago at Gen-Con when Trace was their "Artistic Guest of Honor" (they wanted to focus on under-examined artistic fields every year, and they invited Trace in as a luminary in the field of Puppetry). Someone asked about trading the tapes nowadays and he said something along the lines of "Nope! No, please don't do that. Thanks for loving the show, but we can't do that anymore." It was a weird little moment (and he definitely saw the humor in having a different position than the one backed by one of MST3K's most beloved slogans) but it really underscored how the needs of artists in the biz nowadays aren't necessarily going to be the same as the needs of artists back then.
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Post by ca20 on Feb 25, 2017 5:55:43 GMT -5
I do think that the Kickstarter doners are less likely to do things that might make a 12th season harder to come by. Maybe, but with 48,000 backers there's surely at least one person willing and able to make the episodes available on torrent sites, and that's all it takes.
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Post by ds_36 on Feb 25, 2017 6:40:27 GMT -5
Still... I've a feeling that we'll see less of that kind of problem from MSTies than we would from other shows. I'm probably a bit naive when I say that, but I feel like a lot of us know what we're doing if we're in this deep. Virtually everything gets pirated these days and especially since they're offering DRM free media files it's incredibly easy to do so. There are nearly 40,000 backers should be getting at least one complete episode of the new season from around the world. I'm sure there are at least some of those who aren't necessarily opposed to sharing the show. Even if not the Netflix streams will most likely be capped within a few days of release by regular scene pirates.
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Torgo
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Post by Torgo on Feb 25, 2017 10:52:30 GMT -5
The only things I think should be pirated are the episodes that are unavailable. All art is made to be seen and deserves to have the opportunity to be seen. I understand pirating to a point because it's a way to get unseen art as widely viewed as possible.
I think streaming is very much a future worth striving for, because it could potentially make a good amount of film and television widely available, even the obscure. The way it is today however is squandering the idea a bit, because so much is divided by so many subscription networks that in order to view what I'm in the mood for I have to pay money to ALL of them monthly and even still I have to make due with what I can get. This is why I can't abandon physical media yet, streaming is a great rental service in it's current state, but it's not for collectors and film fanatics like myself.
Take the Simpsons streaming service for example, which they've done away with physical media in favor of. The Simpsons is my favorite show and I'd love to have every episode at my finger tips, but I can't support this. In order to subscribe I need a cable package with FXX. I can't afford a cable package, he'll I can't even guarantee I'd use it (a lot of cable channels are a shadow of their former selves), so I can't watch the episodes I don't own. It's unfortunate and a bit heartbreaking, but it's an example of how streaming isn't working as conveniently as it could be.
But in the case of these episodes, they are available, and they have a simple and cheap enough release that everyone can and should support. If we raised six million dollars to get the show back, we can spare ten bucks for a month of Netflix to watch it. It's that simple.
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