|
Post by dudehitscar on May 15, 2021 13:36:26 GMT -5
I guess season 6 is not that popular around here. It's definitely my favorite Mike season. I love all the episodes Kolos mentioned as well. Am I crazy? I'm Cherokee Jack! What I've seen is that much of the hardcore fanbase that is active in the forums loves season 6. You aren't alone.
|
|
Torgo
Moderator Emeritus
-segment with Crow?
Posts: 15,420
|
Post by Torgo on May 15, 2021 14:15:12 GMT -5
When Sci-Fi picked up the show in 1996, it was primarily airing re-runs of network shows and films. SFC had some original programming in the late '90s (including MST) but they didn't start to really fill out their schedule with original content until around 1999. That basically coincided with their first channel rebrand and, probably not coincidentally, MST's cancellation. Pretty much. Sci-Fi cancelled MST just as Farscape was getting started, which was one of their first shows that I remember people taking notice of and saying "This is pretty good." They were also on the cusp of inhereting Stargate SG-1 and franchising that out with Atlantis, and a few years away from the reboot of Battlestar Galactica, which was one of the most talked about sci-fi shows of its decade. MST fans were pretty bitter when it was cancelled, wondering what that channel had going for it other than bad CGI snake movies, but between those three franchises, Sci-Fi was developing legit nerd cred. Too bad when they decided to return to sci-fi comedy they did it with a series as lame as Tripping the Rift.
|
|
|
Post by dudehitscar on May 15, 2021 22:11:08 GMT -5
If it was just what you said here it honestly wouldn’t even be a problem. However whenever someone says something you don’t happen to agree with, you become oddly confrontational about it. Occasionally with certain folks that deserve it yeah... it's not every time. look at my post history.. plenty of pleasant back and forth even when I disagree. There certainly was nothing confrontational in this thread. Saying 'I am puzzled'.. it's description language saying I don't understand it.. Diet Klos called the use of that language passive aggressive... which is hilarious because he has used the exact same phrasing before.. saying he found something "puzzling". i find the narrative of 'comedy getting more cynical' leading to the decline in ratings during the CC mike years hard to understand given what I witnessed in the culture at that time and the dynamics of the CC mike years.. a descriptive word of 'hard to understand' is 'puzzling'. Is that confrontational to you? Hasn’t it occurred to you that you get into a lot of heated arguments on this forum? it has. Hell sometimes it’s over something as simple as people not liking episodes that you do....like remember the time you took issue with me for calling Atlantic Rim the worst episode? I never took issue with you thinking Atlantic Rim was the worst episode.. I find your extreme hatred for that episode to be pretty entertaining. I went through every single comment I have made about atlantic rim on this forum... including interactions with you. To summarize what I have said to you on this subject.. I expressed surprise that it was so hated given that every fan I've met in real life (DC area mst3k die hard group and casuals) loves the episode. I mentioned that Joel said netflix didn't force him to do any specific movies. you replied defensively and I de-escalated with "don't worry about it man. like what you like" other other interaction was a what I thought friendly banter about whether me hating Hamlet so much it can't possibly be worse than Atlantic Rim. I find your hate of it entertaining and was trying to make you laugh that your description of the atlantic rim episode (and why it sucked) still sounded better than my experience with the Hamlet episode. I then made a joke about them doing atlantic rim 2 in the next season.. and quickly said it was a joke and even I don't want to see that. So I ask you... where did I wrong you in talking about Atlantic Rim? All my posts are there for you to see. Please pull the quote. The biggest issue also seems to come from the fact that the second someone given an opinion of something that you don’t agree with, you don’t respect it. At the end of that day, all any of us here want is just a little respect....but that honestly seems like it’s asking too much from you! there are several comments of mine which are respectful even in times of disagreement... Your statement here is untrue. There are a couple commenters here that have proven they don't deserve my respect but your statement implies I treat everyone that way.. go look look through my posts... it's not true. unlike some of the others I actually care what you think and you are cool with me so I would appreciate a response.
|
|
|
Post by Shane on May 15, 2021 22:36:41 GMT -5
How about we stop bickering and stay on topic. This argument is done.
|
|
|
Post by dudehitscar on May 15, 2021 22:37:37 GMT -5
I know I'm stepping in front of the proverbial bus, but if I could step in and try to be a voice of reason here. I'm going to try and remain neutral in tone and content. lol.. you are really something man.
I think the disconnect between you and other forum members is coming from the fact that you seem to be viewing these discussions as competitive arguments. Where one person puts forward their opinion and then you have to come in and demand proof so they back up their opinion, or so you can say that they're wrong and your opinion is better. When folks are declaring things as fact that doesn't match what I know of the situation I am going to ask for the sources.. sometimes that happens when the debate gets heated.. Not sorry about that. This isn't Reddit. We don't HAVE to make every single discussion a peeing natch. Says the guy who started telling everyone to ignore and report me within my first 4 comments on here. and for what .... my comment was 'Do you not remember the telethon trainwreck and failing to tell us who tom and crow were' in response to the comment that they didn't recall the first kickstarter being frustrating.. you said I was being sarcastic and told folks to ignore me.. I WASN'T being sarcastic.. I was pointing two major things that were frustrating about the first kickstarter campaign. Someone posts an opinion you don't especially agree with, fine. Post your own, but leave out the denigrating tone and snarky asides. Stop with the passive aggressive "these opinions you people have sure are puzzling..." You personally have used the exact same descriptive language.. go look. were you being passive aggressive then? I would say no.. it's very clear what those words mean and it's not passive aggressive. What is passive aggressive was you commenting 'working out great for me.. did you hear something?' to continue on with your 'ignore him/report him' slams on me. And the "cry whine whimper" thing is trolling, and isn't going to make anyone want to take your opinions seriously, regardless of their merit. everyone commenting to report me over and over again for the most insignificant stuff is trolling.. which you started/ this is why the mod showed up and threatened to ban you for it. remember?Just have a polite conversation. Even if other people don't share your exact point of view, its no reason to constantly escalate. And if you can't, just...walk away. Some things can just be let go. Some folks doesn't deserve polite conversations.. lots of others do. I don't constantly escalate.. my post history is fairly balanced.. some folks are jerks and will get treated as so..including when you have been a jerk.. but lots of others I am just having fun discussions with and when we disagree I will say 'I respect that.'.. go look.. it's all there. I am also willing to rebuild relationships with folks I had issues with.. including you sir.-And this is probably good advise for EVERYONE. Sometimes its ok to ignore what upsets you and just...let it go. Ignore it. And move on.Given your history of doing all the things you are telling me not to do I will take this as the closest thing to an apology from you. Apology accepted and I'll work harder to craft my language so my intent comes through better. Apologize for any misunderstanding.. but I really was not attempting to be confrontational or passive aggressive in this thread..
SOOOOO.... are we good now? cheers to saturday night?? yes.
|
|
|
Post by BoB3K on May 15, 2021 22:44:00 GMT -5
Interesting thread. I had lot's to say, but then you all said it, so I just thumbed you all instead.
|
|
|
Post by slainmonkey on May 15, 2021 22:57:19 GMT -5
If it was just what you said here it honestly wouldn’t even be a problem. However whenever someone says something you don’t happen to agree with, you become oddly confrontational about it. Occasionally with certain folks that deserve it yeah... it's not every time. look at my post history.. plenty of pleasant back and forth even when I disagree. There certainly was nothing confrontational in this thread. Saying 'I am puzzled'.. it's description language saying I don't understand it.. Diet Klos called the use of that language passive aggressive... which is hilarious because he has used the exact same phrasing before.. saying he found something "puzzling". i find the narrative of 'comedy getting more cynical' leading to the decline in ratings during the CC mike years hard to understand given what I witnessed in the culture at that time and the dynamics of the CC mike years.. a descriptive word of 'hard to understand' is 'puzzling'. Is that confrontational to you? Hasn’t it occurred to you that you get into a lot of heated arguments on this forum? it has. Hell sometimes it’s over something as simple as people not liking episodes that you do....like remember the time you took issue with me for calling Atlantic Rim the worst episode? I never took issue with you thinking Atlantic Rim was the worst episode.. I find your extreme hatred for that episode to be pretty entertaining. I went through every single comment I have made about atlantic rim on this forum... including interactions with you. To summarize what I have said to you on this subject.. I expressed surprise that it was so hated given that every fan I've met in real life (DC area mst3k die hard group and casuals) loves the episode. I mentioned that Joel said netflix didn't force him to do any specific movies. you replied defensively and I de-escalated with "don't worry about it man. like what you like" other other interaction was a what I thought friendly banter about whether me hating Hamlet so much it can't possibly be worse than Atlantic Rim. I find your hate of it entertaining and was trying to make you laugh that your description of the atlantic rim episode (and why it sucked) still sounded better than my experience with the Hamlet episode. I then made a joke about them doing atlantic rim 2 in the next season.. and quickly said it was a joke and even I don't want to see that. So I ask you... where did I wrong you in talking about Atlantic Rim? All my posts are there for you to see. Please pull the quote. The biggest issue also seems to come from the fact that the second someone given an opinion of something that you don’t agree with, you don’t respect it. At the end of that day, all any of us here want is just a little respect....but that honestly seems like it’s asking too much from you! there are several comments of mine which are respectful even in times of disagreement... Your statement here is untrue. There are a couple commenters here that have proven they don't deserve my respect but your statement implies I treat everyone that way.. go look look through my posts... it's not true. unlike some of the others I actually care what you think and you are cool with me so I would appreciate a response. I’ll concede that some of this could be down to how you word things, and if that is the case I will apologise for taking things the wrong way. But when you’re even saying things like “There are a couple commenters here that have proven they don't deserve my respect”, it doesn’t really inspire confidence in how much you respect people. Remember that early on you seemed to take a lot an issue toward BoB3K because he has pessimistic feeling toward the Kickstarter, and at times seem to be itching for a fight with Diet Kolos. I’m not saying this to beat you down, I’m really not, but you need to take things into account when moving forward. Personally I would love us all to get along, and for this to be nothing more than an unfortunate bump in the road!
|
|
|
Post by dudehitscar on May 15, 2021 23:34:35 GMT -5
I’ll concede that some of this could be down to how you word things, and if that is the case I will apologise for taking things the wrong way. But when you’re even saying things like “There are a couple commenters here that have proven they don't deserve my respect”, it doesn’t really inspire confidence in how much you respect people. Remember that early on you seemed to take a lot an issue toward BoB3K because he has pessimistic feeling toward the Kickstarter, and at times seem to be itching for a fight with Diet Kolos. I’m not saying this to beat you down, I’m really not, but you need to take things into account when moving forward. Personally I would love us all to get along, and for this to be nothing more than an unfortunate bump in the road! You got it backwards with Diet Kolos. He has been up my butt since I got here and trying to get me banned. He also spread hurtful lies about me on reddit to which I had to come here and confront him on. Since the mods told him to knock it off and he acknowledged his mistake on reddit and removed it he has chilled out a bit and I'm cool with him.. Even his hilarious 'neutral peacekeeper' comment in here to me... I responded strongly but overall I actually dig him.. he is cool with me. BoB3K.. no apologies there.. he is disrespectful.. calling Joel a huckster, spinning things constantly to show joel's actions in the worst possible light multiple times per day throughout the kickstarter campaign.. I'm not the only person who has taken issue with him.. go look. But hey the kickstarter campaign is over.. we won.. so I won't have to challenge his nonsense so hard anymore. I can appreciate how my less pleasant interactions with others can color my interactions with you and others I do respect and lead to misunderstandings.. I will try to adjust accordingly to be clear when I am not trying to be confrontational.. or using humor for fun. Cheers sir.
|
|
|
Post by Shane on May 16, 2021 0:28:15 GMT -5
Second warning. Take this crap to pm and get back on topic. Suspensions will follow. This nonsense has ran its course.
|
|
|
Post by Ford Prefect on May 16, 2021 11:07:48 GMT -5
MST3K has never had great ratings. That was never what kept it on the air. The Comedy Channel continued airing it after the first season because it was relatively inexpensive and critics gave the network positive press for airing it at a time when they desperately needed positive attention. After the merger with HA!, MST3K was still the closest thing to a hit the channel had. They were a little worried that the people who made this mildly popular show that the network didn't own might leave, which is why they offered them an almost unheard of deal for three 24 episode seasons. Based on what I've read Mike's arrival didn't hurt ratings, but by this point the management had changed. Doug Herzog was now the head of the network. At that point the network had other hits and he DID care about ratings. Making the movie wasn't a fun experience, but at least it kept them busy since the new management was increasingly less interested in having them on board. Fortunately Barry Schulman was a fan of theirs and he happened to run The SCI-FI Channel. It's not a coincidence that one of the last things he did before he left the network was renew it for the 10th season. After that Bonnie Hammer took over. Suddenly ratings matter again, so it's goodbye MST3K. As for Netflix, I have some guesses. Back in 1989, the team's agent made the argument that since they were making the show for so little money, they should own the copyright and The Comedy Channel agreed. As a result, MST3K has had an unusual amount of independence compared to other shows. That's why Comedy Central made that three year deal with them and SCI-FI wanted them to sign a limited exclusivity deal. As time marches on, exclusivity has become increasingly important for media companies, to the point where they prefer to own as much as possible to simplify things on their end. Since Netflix didn't own MST3K and it didn't appear to be driving a lot of new subscribers, I think that played a role in why they didn't order more despite the critical praise it got. Another reason might be a lack of immediate international success. Roughly half of Netflix subscribers live outside of the US, which is why they decided to show it in Canada, UK, Ireland, New Zealand, and Australia. MST3K has always been pretty niche here in the US, so I can only imagine how niche it must be in other parts of the world. That combined with the fact that Netflix had to clear movie streaming rights for all 20 movies in those countries as well as the US probably didn't help things. Hopefully the more Rifftrax like set up of using the internet to appeal directly to fans will help keep the show afloat so we don't have to deal with the whims of whoever happens to be running the networks.
|
|
|
Post by slainmonkey on May 17, 2021 15:52:15 GMT -5
As an Australian fan, I can attest that it’s basically a niche within a niche here. Before the series came to Netflix, our only export was MST3K The Movie (which actually did make it to theatres here), and release of a couple DVD’s, as such it never gained a lot of traction here. In fact when wearing the T-shirt from the first Kickstarter, I’ve only ever had one person even recognise the show, and that was because they by chance checked it out when it came tom Netflix....it’s part of why I think Joel needs to also try to market the show to a wider international market!
|
|
|
Post by dudehitscar on May 17, 2021 16:37:15 GMT -5
As an Australian fan, I can attest that it’s basically a niche within a niche here. Before the series came to Netflix, our only export was MST3K The Movie (which actually did make it to theatres here), and release of a couple DVD’s, as such it never gained a lot of traction here. In fact when wearing the T-shirt from the first Kickstarter, I’ve only ever had one person even recognise the show, and that was because they by chance checked it out when it came tom Netflix....it’s part of why I think Joel needs to also try to market the show to a wider international market! the audience for MST3K could really explode if we got some real traction in other countries.. I am sure the us/midwest centric humor doesn't help in that regard but maybe with the new era and a wider range of backgrounds it could reach more folks.
|
|
|
Post by slainmonkey on May 17, 2021 17:16:28 GMT -5
As an Australian fan, I can attest that it’s basically a niche within a niche here. Before the series came to Netflix, our only export was MST3K The Movie (which actually did make it to theatres here), and release of a couple DVD’s, as such it never gained a lot of traction here. In fact when wearing the T-shirt from the first Kickstarter, I’ve only ever had one person even recognise the show, and that was because they by chance checked it out when it came tom Netflix....it’s part of why I think Joel needs to also try to market the show to a wider international market! the audience for MST3K could really explode if we got some real traction in other countries.. I am sure the us/midwest centric humor doesn't help in that regard but maybe with the new era and a wider range of backgrounds it could reach more folks. I doubt that would hurt the show that much, I mean here I am, and I haven’t even spent a day in the US, let alone the Midwest. Don’t underestimate how much US entertainment gets shown internationally. I think the bigger issue is that nowhere else has the same kind of history with MST3K, whereas in the US many would have discovered the show through channel surfing, and being like “oh, what is this?” when stumbling upon it. I feel that while a smaller audience than in the US, that there are niche audiences waiting to discover it globally......well at least the English speaking countries, localisation would be insanely problematic with MST3K!
|
|
|
Post by dudehitscar on May 17, 2021 17:38:34 GMT -5
the audience for MST3K could really explode if we got some real traction in other countries.. I am sure the us/midwest centric humor doesn't help in that regard but maybe with the new era and a wider range of backgrounds it could reach more folks. I doubt that would hurt the show that much, I mean here I am, and I haven’t even spent a day in the US, let alone the Midwest. Don’t underestimate how much US entertainment gets shown internationally. I think the bigger issue is that nowhere else has the same kind of history with MST3K, whereas in the US many would have discovered the show through channel surfing, and being like “oh, what is this?” when stumbling upon it. I feel that while a smaller audience than in the US, that there are niche audiences waiting to discover it globally......well at least the English speaking countries, localisation would be insanely problematic with MST3K! YOU ARE WRONG AND CONTINUE TO BE!!! joking... I agree with you. basic exposure is the number one factor for sure. side note: you ever seen this russian MST3K knock off.. www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNH4dafgFZY
|
|
|
Post by slainmonkey on May 17, 2021 17:49:53 GMT -5
I doubt that would hurt the show that much, I mean here I am, and I haven’t even spent a day in the US, let alone the Midwest. Don’t underestimate how much US entertainment gets shown internationally. I think the bigger issue is that nowhere else has the same kind of history with MST3K, whereas in the US many would have discovered the show through channel surfing, and being like “oh, what is this?” when stumbling upon it. I feel that while a smaller audience than in the US, that there are niche audiences waiting to discover it globally......well at least the English speaking countries, localisation would be insanely problematic with MST3K! YOU ARE WRONG AND CONTINUE TO BE!!! joking... I agree with you. basic exposure is the number one factor for sure. side note: you ever seen this russian MST3K knock off.. www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNH4dafgFZYI actually only heard about it during the recent Kickstarter, interestingly I actually do know a Russian MST3K fan, I should ask him about this....honestly I think that’s actually pretty related to my point too. I think the idea of riffing on bad movies is pretty universal, in a way pretty relatable given that in a way many of us just like to poke fun of the goofy things we see on TV....I know I’ve always done it, and that probably plays a big part of what drew me to it!
|
|