|
Post by majorjoe23 on May 18, 2021 12:40:28 GMT -5
It didn’t seem like this quite fit any existing threads. The Birmingham News had an interview with the makers of Demon Squad, who were unaware their movie would be riffed until a few days after the announcement was made. The director doesn’t sound like they were trying to make a SyFy-style movie: “In a way it’s kind of a blessing and a curse,” said Smith. “It means more attention for the movie, which is great. It’s immortalized on MST3K, so that’s cool, just being a fan of the show. We didn’t set out to make a bad movie, or a so-bad-it’s-good movie. We just made a movie. “It’s a low budget movie and that’s probably where most of the ribbing will come from,” he said. “Because it’s a no-budget movie and it was pretty ambitious.” www.al.com/life/2021/05/mystery-science-theater-3000-to-feature-independent-alabama-film.html?fbclid=IwAR04Ft8F6DmGtKaTgKkLYXEs4FRnol-i2mGEnbsguoXTGxrCrEzrJLgLCIo
|
|
Torgo
Moderator Emeritus
-segment with Crow?
Posts: 15,420
|
Post by Torgo on May 18, 2021 13:00:48 GMT -5
Demon Squad is just a movie made by people who had some film equipment and a make-up guy and felt like it. It's actually not an unenjoyable experience, you just need understand what it is when you go into it. It's less of a "SyFy style movie" and more like a modern Eegah, in a way (except better maybe). Or perhaps a more apt comparison is Time Chasers.
It's disappointing that they didn't know about the MST deal until it is announced. That must have been Wild Eye doing the negotiating, but considering they specialize in distributing zero budget movies made by people with no resources at their disposal, one would hope those filmmakers might have some ownership of the movie. I guess Wild Eye just takes it, full stop.
There is some interesting stuff in Wild Eye's library, with Demon Squad being the tip of the iceberg. They have a film called The VelociPastor, which is actually a very clever and tongue-in-cheek parody of high concept, low budget filmmaking with several laugh out loud moments. Last year there was a movie called Ouija Shark, which was made for only $300 in Canada. VelociPastor would gain nothing from being on MST, but Ouija Shark might be fun on the show. Jury is still out on Demon Squad, but it's a "maybe" from what I've seen.
|
|
|
Post by slainmonkey on May 18, 2021 16:23:38 GMT -5
Demon Squad is the one announcement so far I’m not sold on. It doesn’t have me as concerned that as say Atlantic Rim (which is no secret how I feel that turned out), but I’m also not convinced it’s that fitting a movie either. I guess at this point my stance is “we’ll wait and see”, because there’s no point in judging an episode that hasn’t been made yet!
|
|
|
Post by kracker on May 18, 2021 17:49:45 GMT -5
Yeah i saw this and was about to post how they seem to be tickled pink about the announcement.
also the "We didn’t set out to make a bad movie" kinda shows you they dont quite get it and should make you feel better.
I was going to comment that I just watched Atlantic Rim and the reason why its so bad is because they set out to make a cheap piece of crap for a buck. There's just nothing for the writers to work with with all the boring talking scenes. Going into the third act, crow asks 'wasnt this movie supposed to be about robots fighting monsters?'. Then later you have that part where they dont show them getting out of the robots, they just magically disappear, never to be seen again. They just don't care.
Ed Wood and Tommy Wiseau really cared about their movies, even the movies that are truly worse than their movies, the ones that dont get talked about, are big passion projects.
But really it actually comes down to Atlantic Rim wasn't Joel's idea but Demon Squad is, now that we are back to Joel having control over the movies again. And will be the flagship episode for the Gizmoplex at that. So, we keep doubting Joel?
|
|
|
Post by jadenh on May 18, 2021 18:03:16 GMT -5
I'm hoping that Demon Squad will be a good episode. It definitely seems more earnest than something like Atlantic Rim or even Quest of the Delta Knights. I will say that if Gamera Vs. Jiger and Robot Wars end up not being good, I'll be extremely disappointed.
|
|
Torgo
Moderator Emeritus
-segment with Crow?
Posts: 15,420
|
Post by Torgo on May 18, 2021 18:08:56 GMT -5
And will be the flagship episode for the Gizmoplex at that. Actually, if Joel's latest update is to be believed, Gamera vs. Jiger is the flagship episode.
|
|
|
Post by kracker on May 18, 2021 18:36:01 GMT -5
Joel's latest update? Update #20? because its says in big bold that "The third movie we'll riff next season is... " then the Gamera Vs. Jiger graphic.
But then again he says "And you know, I'm also betting this will end up being the "premiere episode" that opens Season 13 and launches the Gizmoplex... hopefully by the end of this year!" so up in the air maybe
that last part does tell us we should be expecting a Turkey Day launch.
|
|
Torgo
Moderator Emeritus
-segment with Crow?
Posts: 15,420
|
Post by Torgo on May 18, 2021 18:49:15 GMT -5
Joel's latest update? Update #20? because its says in big bold that "The third movie we'll riff next season is... " then the Gamera Vs. Jiger graphic. But then again he says "And you know, I'm also betting this will end up being the "premiere episode" that opens Season 13 and launches the Gizmoplex... hopefully by the end of this year!" so up in the air maybe that last part does tell us we should be expecting a Turkey Day launch. That first bit means third movie announced. The second bit clarifies right now he intends for it to be the debut. I'm actually pretty convinced he was going to announce Gamera vs. Jiger during the Gamera vs. Guiron live stream, but they weren't able to clear it in time and they delayed the title announcements and Joel dropped out of the stream to avoid questions about the titles. By the time of the Werewolf livestream he still didn't have clearance for the film, so he announced two movies he knew he could announce. Then he released an update claiming another title was cleared "just today" and that he was eager to share it during the telethon (which was actually announced after the telethon). With all of that, I gather that the release of the titles in announcement does not reflect the release of the titles on the Gizmoplex.
|
|
|
Post by pufncraft on May 19, 2021 15:29:51 GMT -5
That article convinced me to check out Demon Squad on YouTube. I actually really liked it. It super low budget but in a charming way and I thought the two leads had good chemistry. What really matters though is that it's a sincere attempt to make an actual movie, not just an Asylum ripoff (I actually don't mind Atlantic Rim, but I understand why others have issues with it). My only concern with it being an episode is that I had trouble hearing some of the dialogue. Hopefully they either use a better audio track or provide captions like the Netflix episodes.
|
|
|
Post by Afgncaap5 on May 20, 2021 2:20:30 GMT -5
The dirty secret of MST3K is that a movie's badness isn't what makes it good for riffing. I'm sympathetic to the makers of Demon Squad as seeing this as kind of mixed news. Because while most seasoned MST3K viewers know that not all movies picked as experiments in the Forrester family tradition are necessarily bad, the general takeaway to the public is still "MST3K shows us movies that are bad".
Which, in their defense, is what the Forresters believe whenever they force a movie upon a test subject, and what the test subjects themselves see it as.
|
|
Torgo
Moderator Emeritus
-segment with Crow?
Posts: 15,420
|
Post by Torgo on May 20, 2021 3:36:46 GMT -5
The dirty secret of MST3K is that a movie's badness isn't what makes it good for riffing. I'm sympathetic to the makers of Demon Squad as seeing this as kind of mixed news. Because while most seasoned MST3K viewers know that not all movies picked as experiments in the Forrester family tradition are necessarily bad, the general takeaway to the public is still "MST3K shows us movies that are bad". Which, in their defense, is what the Forresters believe whenever they force a movie upon a test subject, and what the test subjects themselves see it as. I agree somewhat. Demon Squad isn't a bad movie, it's just a really cheap one. If I made that movie then someone told me two years later it was an MST episode I'd be like "Oh...I love MST but I actually worked really hard on that." That's probably the way the director of Final Sacrifice feels. That being said, preconceived notions are hard to steer around. I'm sure most of the people who watch Demon Squad on the show and think it's terrible likely weren't going to enjoy it anyway because they can't look past the resources that went into it. Just look at how many people assumed it was Atlantic Rim Take 2 the minute Joel announced it. Even if someone tried to clarify what it was, people were going to run with that concept despite its falsehood because that's the scenario that makes sense to them. People see what they want to see. But you know, some movies can escape the MST vacuum. A lot of people claim we desecrated This Island Earth, but I think that movie's reputation is pretty much exactly the same today, with MST just being a footnote. And movies like Time Chasers expanded their audience pretty successfully through the show. I kind of hope Demon Squad is the latter.
|
|
|
Post by Afgncaap5 on May 20, 2021 14:36:18 GMT -5
Yeah, Time Chasers is a good example of a "Cheap, but honestly not so bad" movie that MST3K and Rifftrax did that actually benefited from it. I think the emphasis of the term "Cheesy" in the theme song and in a lot of MST3K's promo material might be notable. A film needn't be "bad" to be "Cheesy", but it helps. Cheesiness might include...
*Being "bad" (naturally) *Cheaply produced *Grainy film quality *Speculative fiction elements (sci-fi, horror, fantasy, super spy, mystic powers, martial arts, etc.) *"Tradutional" sci-fi or horror fare that might've been good but is considered cliche now (Rubber monster costume, flying saucers, etc.) *Insane Premise (Santa Claus and his storied conquest of Mars...) *Some notable combination... *Dialogue space to allow riffs to get in (Probably the second most important feature) *Attainable rights (Probably the most important feature)
|
|
|
Post by demoniclambertobava on May 21, 2021 3:09:37 GMT -5
Some of the best MST films are ones that are cheap or poorly done but with an engaging plot, a fun character or two or occasionally even some wit. Something genuinely admirable. Overdrawn at the Memory Bank and Time Chasers are clearly passionately committed to whatever the hell it is they're doing for two nickels they found to rub together, as is Hobgoblins. They're still bad movies IMO, but they have heart and you can see some of what they were going for. I remember the Amazing Colossal Episode Guide also waxing rhapsodic about Beverly Garland's character in The Beginning of the End(?) for being such a tough cookie, and they always had a fondness for her after that, as did I. (I remember loving the Swamp Diamonds ep as a kid, which some people seem to despise now) Many of the Italian films of the 70s and 80s they've shown over the years are the same, and I'm not just saying that as an Italian genre buff in general. Starcrash is up there, and I'd kill to see them do Luigi Cozzi's equally silly Contagion but it may be too violent.
I also think a number of the 70s KTMA films - Superdome, SST Death Flight, City on Fire - are genuinely engaging supercheese, not good movies but very silly and diverting, and I will always wish they'd been done again with stronger riffing. This is a big reason why I so enjoy Avalanche and Killer Fish, which are the same period, style and rich density of silly characters, subplots and overall period goofiness. I'd be thrilled if those KTMA films were resurrected now, as so many other old MSTs have been by RT. Moon Zero Two never got a great treatment either, IMO. Phase IV, OTOH, is a genuine masterpiece of a film, legitimately good, yet I can totally see why MST did it.
|
|
|
Post by Mighty Jack on May 23, 2021 4:56:42 GMT -5
As someone whose written and performed music, I'm not insensitive to what a person goes through to create something, the love, and work that goes into it. Saying that, using the argument that people worked hard on a film and you should give them a break, etc... eh, most people work hard, presidential administrations, popes, sports heroes, etc, etc, but comedy doesn't hold back on any of them. Why should movie makers and their films (good or bad) be exempt?
As for reputation, if these past few years have taught me anything, people are going to think whatever they want. So I'm just going to focus on me - and MST actually got me interested in these movies and several of the actors. I became a Bruno VeSota fan for example, and I delight whenever I see him pop up on TV. I was watching an episode of Leave it to Beaver on TV, and he showed up in a small role, and I was actually thrilled about it (Hey, it's Bruno!) I mean, come on, that doesn't happen without MST3K.
I've also seen nearly every Arch Hall Jr. movie for goodness sake, several of those unmsted, like the Sadist, Wild Guitar, Deadwood '76, even Eegah - "Nasty Rabbit" is the last left to see (and I spoke with AHjr years ago, and we was fine with MST because it put the spotlight on these films that had been largely forgotten, suddenly people are seeking out other productions he starred it, wanting autographs, wanting product)
I think some B-movie fans can be a bit too sensitive, even a bit deluded (Screaming Skull on the DVD extras, Tom Weaver calling critics idiots because the movie made some kids happy... and then the actress who starred in it acknowledged that it wasn't effective, and felt those kids should see the 'much better' originals it was based on (Rebecca) - so in his zeal for the flick he's inadvertently insulted the star. lol)
But yeah, I know there's some good work done on some of these movies too - you have an Oscar-winning cinematographer on The Crawling Hand, and there's some real sharp camera work and lighting to be found in that one. So I'm not dumb, I have a brain - even if the song says they are "the worst they can find" I know that's not always true.
Anyway, what I really came over here to share, if you've not visited the MST Facebook page, Joel said they are close to finalizing their slate of movies for season 13. I wonder what (aside from the 3 we know) he has in store for us?
|
|
|
Post by Megalon on May 23, 2021 20:11:29 GMT -5
Anyway, what I really came over here to share, if you've not visited the MST Facebook page, Joel said they are close to finalizing their slate of movies for season 13. I wonder what (aside from the 3 we know) he has in store for us? We hit the 3D movie incentive, didn't we? So one of those. As for the rest... I'll be a little surprised if they do another Atlantic Rim-style movie, but maybe even more surprised if they don't. I have a feeling those movies are popular with kids, which is a market that Joel probably wants to capture. Also, I'm hoping we'll get another B&W movie at long last, but that'll only happen if someone talks Joel into it. He made it clear in his last interview that he's against doing B&W and 4:3 films. Another sword & sorcery (or sword & sandal) film seems likely. And possibly another Avalanche-style 70's disaster movie, or something along the line of Killer Fish.
|
|