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Post by ds_36 on Nov 22, 2023 17:23:52 GMT -5
There's consequences if you bring it to court and get it in front of a judge. Based on Connectionpoint's TOS it looks like they don't guarantee anything at all. And based on the wording on the website I'm not sure if this campaign is backed by any larger organization that could step in. Essentially it would be up to the upset funders to retain attorneys and get it going. Some funders will be happy with the end result and some won't want to deal with a legal battle. Actually getting results is a challenge.
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Post by ds_36 on Nov 22, 2023 15:45:58 GMT -5
I'm not sure I'm getting why saying we need less money will generate more money...? Simple it seems achievable to reach the goal.
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Post by ds_36 on Nov 22, 2023 13:51:35 GMT -5
Going to be honest though, when I started reading that update I really expected him to say that they were just going to pack it in and try again later. Just based on his recent interviews of being resigned to not doing it anymore. I was legitimately shocked that they would change it at all or try to keep going. That's where I thought it was going too. Maybe having to continue is because of some behind the scenes obligations going on.
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Post by ds_36 on Nov 22, 2023 13:37:51 GMT -5
Not to say Kickstarter is any better but I like these two bits from Connectionpoint's terms of service. You acknowledge that we have no control over and do not guarantee the quality, safety or legality of campaigns, the truth or accuracy of content, listings, or ability to perform the stated objective. As a Contributor, you are solely responsible for asking questions and investigating Campaigns to the extent you feel is necessary before you make a Contribution. All Contributions are made voluntarily and at your sole discretion and risk. (connectionpoint) doesn’t guarantee that Contributions will be used as promised, that Campaign Owners will deliver Incentives, or that the Campaign will achieve its goals. (connectionpoint) does not endorse, guarantee, make representations, or provide warranties for or about the quality, safety, morality or legality of any Campaign, Incentive or Contribution, or the truth or accuracy of content posted on the Service. You are solely responsible for determining how to treat your Contribution and receipt of any Incentives for tax purposes. In the event you are issued a refund on your Contribution because of our inability to disburse funds to a Campaign Owner, you will no longer be entitled to delivery of any Incentives associated with your contribution. Basically you're on your own if the campaign succeeds and doesn't deliver. Just to compare from Kickstarter's TOS When a project is successfully funded, the creator must complete the project and fulfill each reward. Once a creator has done so, they’ve satisfied their obligation to their backers. Throughout the process, creators owe their backers a high standard of effort, honest communication, and a dedication to bringing the project to life. At the same time, backers must understand that they’re not buying something when they back a project—they’re helping to create something new, not ordering something that already exists. There may be changes or delays, and there’s a chance something could happen that prevents the creator from being able to finish the project as promised. If a creator is unable to complete their project and fulfill rewards, they’ve failed to live up to the basic obligations of this agreement. To right this, they must make every reasonable effort to find another way of bringing the project to the best possible conclusion for backers. A creator in this position has only remedied the situation and met their obligations to backers if: - they post an update that explains what work has been done, how funds were used, and what prevents them from finishing the project as planned;
- they work diligently and in good faith to bring the project to the best possible conclusion in a timeframe that’s communicated to backers;
- they’re able to demonstrate that they’ve used funds appropriately and made every reasonable effort to complete the project as promised;
- they’ve been honest, and have made no material misrepresentations in their communication to backers; and
they offer to return any remaining funds to backers who have not received their reward (in proportion to the amounts pledged), or else explain how those funds will be used to complete the project in some alternate form.
The creator is solely responsible for fulfilling the promises made in their project. If they’re unable to satisfy the terms of this agreement, they may be subject to legal action by backers. Kickstarter reserves the right to take any action it deems appropriate with respect to campaign funds while a dispute is pending. I mean I get you're probably just as out of luck either way but at least Kickstarter does suggest there's obligations on the part of the campaigner.
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Post by ds_36 on Nov 22, 2023 13:26:05 GMT -5
"If we make these two changes, along with a few smaller ones, we are able to trim almost $800,000 from the budget, bringing the total cost of 6 episodes down to $4 million – a goal that might still be a challenge difficult to reach, but is far closer than $4.8m. Still more than double what the currently raised amount is. I suppose there's a slight chance of hitting $2 million today. But doubling that in a three day period during a glacially slow campaign? Also I'm surprised to see that they were able to lower the goal. I wonder if they'll just lower the goal to whatever it's at on Saturday night so they can call this a success? Then they'll somehow generously come up with six episodes putting them even further in the financial hole.
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Post by ds_36 on Nov 22, 2023 13:07:25 GMT -5
Is there the slightest chance that someone could get off their ass and do a livestream Saturday night? That's mostly a rhetorical question, because their level of motivation for doing anything is non-existent, but did they leave that window of time open deliberately when they were scheduling things weeks and months ago? I bet that was the original plan when they thought they'd have another record breaking campaign and they could be there smiling and excited to show how well they did. Now there's nobody who's going to want to be on camera declaring how poorly they've done.
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Post by ds_36 on Nov 21, 2023 16:40:02 GMT -5
Honestly, it almost seems like it's better for the campaign to stay vague. I'd watch either host as long as they used Jonah's bots, but I don't know how some of the backers feel. There's absolutely no way to make everyone happy. Keeping quiet may have been the smartest play. But it'll go over even worse for those who don't like the decisions on the next fundraiser.
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Post by ds_36 on Nov 21, 2023 15:46:31 GMT -5
Eeryone was mad at Jim at some point so he was maybe a good producer but not good at dealing with people. Everyone's a little upset. That's how you know you're doing a good job. Matt McGinnis seems like a good producer but can he tell Joel "no"? Good question about authority versus power. Matt hosts the special events and has largely become the face of the campaign but I still feel like it's mostly Joel in control. If Joel wants to hand off power he needs to just allow the switch to happen. But I think he's become too intertwined with the show for that to happen. Just a few more hours till we find out the next 3 episodes and get some sort of casting announcement! Although small these things still seem to benefit the campaign.
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Post by ds_36 on Nov 19, 2023 13:57:07 GMT -5
The problem is that it would be the final 6 episodes unless they figure something else out, which is a depressing way to end a crowdfunder. If they come back for season 15 (assuming they hit the goal) it's going to be even smaller. Regardless of what happens now I fully expect Joel to try again in a year or two with even higher goals. He'll probably need the extra money since he's figured out the reason that people haven't been too enthuastic is because there's no live video of the cast flying a helicopter which he now needs to buy.
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Post by ds_36 on Nov 19, 2023 12:12:32 GMT -5
The bigger dollar backers *might* get this past the first tier, but I think it’s fair to expect the overall the number of backers to waaay, waaay down no matter what the outcome is. This should be incredibly alarming for the long term. The base is shrinking. The awareness/effort explanation can only go so far; it’s fair to expect some attrition given the economy, but even with a shrinking base, a significant portion of that base is actively choosing not to contribute. I wonder how Joel et al would actually feel about a 6 episode season. On one hand it leads to a really nice release schedule. Alternating months between a movie and a short. If there was a full time team working on this that was changing with feedback I think it could work well. We're still quite far from even being halfway to the first goal. If some giant backers don't show it's hard to believe it'll get there. All this demonstrates why you need an unpopular enemy making the business decisions rather than the popular face.
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Post by ds_36 on Nov 17, 2023 16:42:44 GMT -5
Per the latest update looks like "some" cast will be present for Tuesday's event.
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Post by ds_36 on Nov 17, 2023 4:49:08 GMT -5
Well now I'm REALLY annoyed. Where the hell has Shout been these past 3 (4 with Season 12 fundraiser) campaigns? They should be paying for half, minimum. Or at the VERY LEAST securing the movie rights for free. Likely they've run the numbers and know it's not really profitable. Joel needing to have full creative control and spend large amounts of money on completely pointless things wouldn't help Shout's interest either. This might actually be a benefit if Joel quits they'll be able to make episodes much cheaper maybe at a point where it's profitable to them. So journalists get free Season 13 Blu-rays but nobody can buy them. Brilliant. I always used to be a fan of physical media. But these days where everybody streams everything how many people really would buy a physical DVD/Blu-ray? The die hard fan who would be more interested in the extras and just collecting it already got it through the fundraiser. The more casual fan probably isn't really interested. A manufacture on demand solution might be the perfect answer.
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Post by ds_36 on Nov 16, 2023 18:37:34 GMT -5
"We’ve been announcing the movies we’ve cleared. We actually had to clear all the movies for this season [to determine the budget]—that’s how we got to the [crowdfunding] number we needed to reach."
Isn't that putting the cart before the horse? I guess everyone also just thought there was no way this could fail.
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Post by ds_36 on Nov 15, 2023 16:26:14 GMT -5
[I like that it's only Gypsy, Servo, and Crow on it, and not the Cast of Thousands. Wonder if that means anything? Well there's three bots and this is the third weekday of the third week of the campaign. It was just code for when to post it.
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Post by ds_36 on Nov 15, 2023 15:09:14 GMT -5
Yeah, it's a real, "don't expect anything of substance until next week" kind of update. Give the guy credit. If there's one thing he's good at it's promising future updates - that are often delayed if they arrive at all.
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