|
Post by Blurryeye on Mar 15, 2004 16:08:50 GMT -5
I saw "Clerks" for the first time on Saturday night. I have heard much about this movie, mainly from my good friends in high school. My best friend loved it. But I never got around to seeing it. Flipping through the guide, I saw that it was on an HBO channel, at the beginning, so I thought, "hey, it's this 'classic/cult' movie that I've never seen but always kind of wanted to, finally I can see what all the fuss was about."
I can't tell you how thoroughly disappointed I was. In fact, I turned it off after the first half hour. I saw "Dogma" in the theater, and the first hour of "Jay and Silent Bob strike back". Dogma was okay, kind of amusing, but rather inconsequential. I don't think I need to say how much "Jay and Silent Bob..." sucked. But "Clerks" was supposed to be his best movie, the groundbreaking influential defining work of Generation X, inspiring many smartypants young amateur independent filmmakers to voice their apathy.
What a bunch of bull. The movie may have seemed innovative and relevant at the time, 1994, ten years ago. I am not surprised that many people thought it was cool. But viewing it as a relative 'outsider' ten years later, I have a different viewpoint. This is my description of it: A series of vignettes on the occurences at a convenience store and video store, ranging from stiflingly unfunny to amusing at best, featuring bad acting; a script that is obviously a diatribe on laziness, sex, apathy, sex, stupidity, sex, pseudo-intellectual babble, and sex; and the director's insistence that he is giving a sharp, incisive commentary on society today in a very clever way, without being sharp, incisive, or clever.
I am sure the intention of the amateur acting skills on display was to give a more 'real', natural portrayal of interaction between ordinary youths. But the stiff, unemotional delivery of the very 'writerly' lines had just the opposite effect. I know that the dialogue in most movies is not entirely realistic, but a good actor can make it seem so, or at least make the viewer not care. It had a very 'community theater' feel to it: I will say my line that I just memorized 10 minutes ago, then pause for you to say your line right after mine (without any break), then say the next line with no break at all. And it will sound smart and sharp, because we are saying the lines in quick succession. Never mind the wooden, rote memorization delivery.
The characters are pretty much vile pieces of dreck, and the viewer is supposed to like them and relate to them. So what was Kevin Smith trying to say? Young people today (back then) are smart slackers, very uninvolved and unconcerned with improving what they see around them, making smart-aleck remarks on how pathetic and stupid the middle-class is. Okay, I don't have a problem with making fun of people, or I wouldn't be an MST3K fan, but the jokes should at least be FUNNY.
This is going to be a long post, so I'll make a break here.
|
|
|
Post by Blurryeye on Mar 15, 2004 16:46:49 GMT -5
There were a few parts that made me smile, don't get me wrong. I especially liked one exchange between the video store clerk and a woman customer. She asks him which of two movies she's holding up is better, he says he doesn't watch movies, and doesn't pay attention to reviews. So she tricks him by holding up the same two movies and asking about them, and he says "Yeah, those are good". Well, then she points out that they were the same movies, so he wasn't paying attention, and she just proved it (see how pointless this is?). Then he says, "And I bet it felt good." Woman: "What felt good?" Clerk: "Being right. There's nothing as invigorating as pointing out the shortcomings of others." W: "Screw you! You just lost a customer!" (Storms out). C: (Shouting out the door): "You're not allowed to rent here anymore!" Sooooo many people are pointing out how right they are these days, and I thought that was a good comeback, noting how good it feels to point out the shortcomings of others. But other than that, I found the movie to be ultimately pointless. An incoherent assembly of rants and bad jokes (Kevin Smith: "Aren't I clever? Here is a woman with a little girl in the video store, and the clerk is making an order on the phone, and he lists the titles of a bunch of porn movies in alphabetical order, right in front of the little girl! Hahaha, aren't I funny? I mean, he says cock, cum, tight holes, dick, sluts, etc. in front of a little girl! And he doesn't care! Funny, huh?"). Uh, no, it isn't. By now you're probably wondering what exactly my point is. I mean, this is a pretty long rant, and I'm obviously pissed off by this movie, but so what, it's only one opinion, right? My point is this: there are some movies that are influential and considered to be relevant in their own time, but do not stand up to the true test of relevance, the test of time. "Clerks" is one of those movies. Did it inspire numerous other films? Yes. The Gen X post-modern slacker amateur independent filmmaker genre took off from this movie. All of those pseudo-intelligent comments on the apathy of youth were inspired by this movie. And it was a road that turned out to lead nowhere. That whole "gen X ironic, just don't give a damn" attitude has turned stale and died on the vine, because that attitude is one of self-pity that does not change anything. People have gotten tired of it because it is stupid. That kind of dimly-ironic post-modern apathy is passe'. What a bunch of brats these Gen-Xers were. I am 23, and I would not like to be associated with this group of self-absorbed slobs. Kevin Smith has proven himself to be a one-trick pony, and his gimmick has been flogged to death. He says things that are sort of funny sometimes, but that's the limit of his talent. What is truly unforgiveable is his conviction that he is really smart and erudite. He has been feeding on heaping helpings of his own gargantuan ego for a long time now, and I hope that his huge head explodes from the injections of empty self-congratulation he gives himself over and over (just look at the promos he's done for "Dogma" being shown on Comedy Central lately. You'll see what I mean). I think that the end is nigh, that he boldly put his non-talent on display with J&SB Strike Back, and people have caught on to the inconsequence of his ideas. Plus, "Jersey Girl", with the impressively bland and newly un-hip Ben Affleck, is due to come out soon, and that just may be the nail in the coffin for Smith. I sincerely hope that fans of "Clerks" will turn to each other and say, "This is the guy we thought was the hero of our generation?" It's time for "Clerks" to be re-evaluated. It has not aged well, judging by what I saw on Saturday. I couldn't believe that bit of pretentious emptiness was hailed as a classic for the age. Truly disappointed. Truly, truly, truly. So, uh, what do you think?
|
|
|
Post by Blurryeye on Mar 15, 2004 16:55:27 GMT -5
But other than that, I found the movie to be ultimately pointless. An incoherent assembly of rants and bad jokes (Kevin Smith: "Aren't I clever? Here is a woman with a little girl in the video store, and the clerk is making an order on the phone, and he lists the titles of a bunch of porn movies in alphabetical order, right in front of the little girl! Hahaha, aren't I funny? I mean, he says "Rowsdower", cum, tight holes, dick, sluts, etc. in front of a little girl! And he doesn't care! Funny, huh?"). Uh, no, it isn't. Hey, I just noticed that I wrote cock, and it was replaced with "Rowsdower". This must be some moderating thing. Just for clarification, I wanted to say cock, but every time cock is written, it actually shows up as "Rowsdower". So, for anyone who is confused, it should say cock, not "Rowsdower". (I think you get the idea anyway).
|
|
|
Post by Mr. Atari on Mar 15, 2004 16:59:29 GMT -5
Hey, I just noticed that I wrote "Rowsdower", and it was replaced with "Rowsdower". This must be some moderating thing. Just for clarification, I wanted to say "Rowsdower", but every time "Rowsdower" is written, it actually shows up as "Rowsdower". So, for anyone who is confused, it should say "Rowsdower", not "Rowsdower". (I think you get the idea anyway). That's hilarious. Certain words have built in censored replacements on this board. A good way to find out what gets censored is to put the naughty word in another non-naughty word. For example, noted director Alfred Hitchc0ck, comes out Alfred Hitch"Rowsdower". I'm sure that could lead to confusion when you want to talk about your chicken profession. Fun, won't you? As for the topic, I agree- Kevin Smith is overrated and Clerks was a waste of time. Dogma had its moments, but it really could have used a screenwriter consultant. #nosmileys
|
|
|
Post by Blurryeye on Mar 15, 2004 17:07:39 GMT -5
Damn the censorship board! I mean, what if someone is innocently writing about a male chicken? "Rowsdowers" are known for their beautiful plumage, with proud, brightly-colored tailfeathers and grand crests. Cocks also are known for their aggression toward other cocks, at the point of fighting to the death for the claim to mate with a nearby hen. Sometimes cocks are used illegally in cock fights, a sport particularly loved in Mexico. This inhumane practice of cock fighting results in lost feathers, shredded flesh, and much bloodshed.
But many cocks are not particularly aggressive, and can even be kept as pets. Beautiful cocks are shown in county and state fairs. It has been said that there is a special pride felt by the owner of a prize-winning, stately cock. A cock by any other name would still make one's heart skip a beat. Yes, the cock is a proud, colorful creature, one of nature's finest works of art."
A complete disaster, I tell you!
|
|
|
Post by Blurryeye on Mar 15, 2004 17:11:25 GMT -5
Yay, I made a moderator laugh!
|
|
TomServo69
Moderator Emeritus
Gone but not Forgotten
Nothing ever changes........
Posts: 5,467
|
Post by TomServo69 on Mar 15, 2004 17:52:47 GMT -5
Damn the censorship board! I mean, what if someone is innocently writing about a male chicken? "Rowsdowers" are known for their beautiful plumage, with proud, brightly-colored tailfeathers and grand crests. "Rowsdower"s also are known for their aggression toward other "Rowsdower"s, at the point of fighting to the death for the claim to mate with a nearby hen. Sometimes "Rowsdower"s are used illegally in "Rowsdower" fights, a sport particularly loved in Mexico. This inhumane practice of "Rowsdower" fighting results in lost feathers, shredded flesh, and much bloodshed. But many "Rowsdower"s are not particularly aggressive, and can even be kept as pets. Beautiful "Rowsdower"s are shown in county and state fairs. It has been said that there is a special pride felt by the owner of a prize-winning, stately "Rowsdower". A "Rowsdower" by any other name would still make one's heart skip a beat. Yes, the "Rowsdower" is a proud, colorful creature, one of nature's finest works of art." A complete disaster, I tell you! LMAO!!!! This is what I was thinking of doing, but, I didn't have the patience to do it. That's so hilarious. Oh yeah, and I also think that Kevin Smith is played out. He's a cockhead. And you're a cockhead too. Hehehehehehe, Servo
|
|
Jok1
Nanite
Posts: 49
|
Post by Jok1 on Mar 15, 2004 17:57:44 GMT -5
I gonna have to disagree with most of what was written. I love Kevin Smith's movies, particularly Clerks and Dogma. I think it's mainly because I'm a sucker for the various comic book and other pop culture references.
I do agree that some of the dialogue in Clerks is a bit dodgy.
Maybe you should check out his 3rd movie, Chasing Amy. It was critically acclaimed and most people who hated his other films like that movie. On the other hand I'm not a huge fan of it.
|
|
|
Post by Buddhist Kitten on Mar 15, 2004 18:00:23 GMT -5
I never saw any of Kevin Smith's films, except for "Dogma" And that was when I was about nine-ish. I should check out this guy.
|
|
|
Post by nightfalcawk on Mar 15, 2004 20:11:08 GMT -5
You're all a buch of "Rosdowers" !
|
|
|
Post by mightyjack on Mar 15, 2004 23:06:32 GMT -5
I find Kevin Smith to be greatly overrated.
He's an idea man and that's it. He can't flesh those ideas out. So you get this superficial flash (no substance) and terrible endings which reak of the banal.
Everyone has their opinion but Smith frustrates me because he can't deliver on the promise of his good ideas.
|
|
|
Post by BobJohnson on Mar 16, 2004 9:46:09 GMT -5
I gonna have to disagree with most of what was written. I love Kevin Smith's movies, particularly Clerks and Dogma. I think it's mainly because I'm a sucker for the various comic book and other pop culture references. I do agree that some of the dialogue in Clerks is a bit dodgy. Maybe you should check out his 3rd movie, Chasing Amy. It was critically acclaimed and most people who hated his other films like that movie. On the other hand I'm not a huge fan of it. Yeah, Chasing Amy was his best IMO because he took a conventional plot, man falls in love with woman, and added a twist, she is a lesbian. For me, I like Clerks and Dogma. Blurryeye, I suggest watching clerks again and you may understand it more, same with Dogma. It took me 5 viewings to truly appreciate it.
|
|
|
Post by lemminkimmen on Mar 16, 2004 10:34:17 GMT -5
I'm with you all the way, Blurry- Smith is over-rated, IMO.
And please don't get me started on Affleck- He is to acting what Gallagher was to stand-up.
IMO, of course.
There.
I sadi it.
Happy now?
|
|
|
Post by ManWithoutHat on Mar 21, 2004 20:46:45 GMT -5
The thing is, Kevin Smith really isn't for everyone. You have to be in the mood to have an idea slapped down in front of you and beaten the crap out of for two hours, with no small amount of intellectual monologues along the way.
Personally, "Clerks." (please don't forget the fecking period, you Philistines) is one of my all-time favorites. I guess the difference between people who get him and people who don't is whether one can see his films for what they are, character studies of realistic people grappling with realistic issues, or what they appear to be, two-hour orgies of cursing, sex, and drugs.
The same argument is being held over "The Passion of the Christ." Is it a graphic portrayal of Christ's unconditional love for us, or two hours of pouring blood on the audience?
To quote the Geto Boyz, "Everything's cool in the mind of a gangsta cause real gangsta ass gentlemans (aka Smithies) think deep."
I guess this all just leaves my head "Rowsdower"ed to one side.
Incidentally, I like Hitch"Rowsdower". And "Rowsdower" fights. Just as long as no one "Rowsdower"s everything up.
~Steve Herbert Hoover! ;D
|
|
|
Post by Ator on Mar 21, 2004 21:13:19 GMT -5
I liked Clerks. It wasn't my favorite movie or anything, but it was interesting.
|
|