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Post by dc41 on Nov 26, 2023 12:23:17 GMT -5
The Official Post Mortem is up at the Showmaker site: Greetings, backers. Well, we’ve come to the end of the month, and the end of the Turkey Day Marathon and this campaign. While we’re incredibly grateful for all of the support, enthusiasm, and encouragement, it’s clear we’ve fallen short of our goal this time. First, to be clear, please understand that that means that no one will be charged anything, and we will not be collecting anything that you pledged to this campaign , since the agreement was that we’d only collect funds if we reached our minimum goal. No charges will be put on anyone’s credit cards. Second, and more important, please know that we’re incredibly grateful for all of your input, feedback, concerns and questions, and are thinking about all the suggestions you have made over the past month. One silver lining is that the continued support for this campaign, and the show, may have opened up some new conversations about potential partnerships and fundraising that could be key in getting the show another season. We’ll spend some time now exploring those, and working to integrate all of the feedback and suggestions we’ve heard from you, and will follow up again next year, Lord willing and the creek don’t rise, when we’ve had a chance to regroup and have more to share downstream. For now, whether you pledged or not, please accept our thanks and gratitude for your ongoing dedication and investment in MST3K. We’re proud that the show continues to mean so much, to so many, and will keep working to figure out a path forward so that we can hopefully continue to #MakeMoreMST3K. Until then, have a wonderful holiday season, and thanks again for all of your support. Cheers and Thanks, Joel and Team MST3K Appreciate the words from Joel and apparent willingness to learn. There are clearly a lot of people out there - like everyone who posts anywhere - that do love the show and want it to thrive.
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Post by Shark on Nov 26, 2023 12:30:42 GMT -5
Yeah, they should have been planning the next fundraiser while they were airing new content. Though I guess I understand wanting to wait until all the gifts went out. I'll admit I knew nothing about how people were mad(?) about shipping/deadlines/fulfilment/etc. I don't go to the official forum or the FB group anymore because it is 90% memes, so that all went over my head. I paid and forgot about it - hey, they'll send the blurays eventually. Like, I supported this kickstarter back in 2012 (!!!) and he just finished the book and sent it to us this year! It's just odd they didn't use the lessons from the previous fundraisers and doubled down on complicated rewards. I gotta figure that's Joel thinking of a popcorn bucket (and it is a neat idea) but no one saying "we can't do that" once they look in to cost/design/shipping/etc. I was glad to see only easy to ship items this year, not even any posters that have to be tubed separately. And man, just compare the look of the season 12 Kickstarter description page compared to the look of this: showmaker.mst3k.com/makeseason14. Campaign fees dropped from 8% to 5%, but I dunno if it was worth it. I seriously doubt Matt or anyone from the MST3K team are really looking at any of these threads here, but if they are, I will say that I backed the first day and really would like to have more of the show in the future. I hope that "sharing more next year" means more like in Jan/Feb as opposed to Oct/Nov.
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Post by Diet Kolos on Nov 26, 2023 12:37:56 GMT -5
One silver lining is that the continued support for this campaign, and the show, may have opened up some new conversations about potential partnerships and fundraising that could be key in getting the show another season. Good luck. But if they're fundraising, again, the attrition is going to be rough. So I hope whatever partnerships come with their own sources of funding, in addition to whatever they can mooch off fans. See you all again in 2-6 months!
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Post by missionpanic on Nov 26, 2023 12:40:30 GMT -5
Excellent letter from Joel. I hope some of these partnerships work - maybe another streamer reached out, one of those FAST networks like Tubi or FreeVee. If they can bring it back and do a smaller fundraiser with the cast and full support then I think they'll succeed.
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Post by monkeypretzel on Nov 26, 2023 12:46:27 GMT -5
I would love nothing more than new shows that make me laugh. That's all I ask.
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Post by Diet Kolos on Nov 26, 2023 12:55:00 GMT -5
A more consistent, polished, stripped down Season 11 would be KILLER. Give me 13 episodes of Cry Wilderness, Avalanche, Beast of Hollow Mountain & Land That Time Forgot (but streamlined and the rough edges sanded out) and you'd have a very happy fanbase.
Season 13 was halfway there, but poor, boring riff writing and bad production on-the-whole felt like they took a big step backwards. And they didn't seem to understand that.
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Post by BoB3K on Nov 26, 2023 13:02:07 GMT -5
I have to say, I'm surprised that they bothered putting out that message. Although, it really is an obligation as I'm still not convinced the majority of people understand how these pledge and pay if it succeeds campaigns work, and they needed to state explicitly that no one would get charged anything.
I'm not sure where they go from here, because this campaign has brought out a new twist -- there apprently really are hardcore NuMST3K fans. I just plain didn't like the newest crew, but I could have given Emily a chance if it weren't for unwatchable Crow, but there were fans out there that were specifically pissed that Jonah was getting replaced. Really? I actually liked Jonah a good bit (thought Crow was pretty good, was lukewarm on Tom), but he did like half a CC era season. Who cares. ... But wait, there's now apparently people that will be up in arms if Emily and muppet-crow don't come back. Joel has made a complete mess of all this.
Bottom line, I'm not sure how they even see the 18K backers they got from this one come back next time.
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Post by Diet Kolos on Nov 26, 2023 13:07:21 GMT -5
but there were fans out there that were specifically pissed that Jonah was getting replaced. Really? I actually liked Jonah a good bit (thought Crow was pretty good, was lukewarm on Tom), but he did like half a CC era season. Who cares. ... But wait, there's now apparently people that will be up in arms if Emily and muppet-crow don't come back. Joel has made a complete mess of all this. That's a no-win situation. And its probably a reason they didn't indicate who the cast would be, even outside of the strike. You don't win no matter who hosts now, unless you do both. And even then, there's a THIRD group of people that don't want another split season, regardless of who the hosts are.
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Post by BoB3K on Nov 26, 2023 13:09:08 GMT -5
A more consistent, polished, stripped down Season 11 would be KILLER. I would be thrilled with a stripped down season 11. I don't even need Jonah and gang back, just give me three likable COMEDIANS that write and deliver the riffs, and probably play the mads too. I think I already said this elsewhere, but a realistic goal would be to ask like $2.5M for a 6+ episode season, and also, get it on a real damn streaming service, even something like Tubi or Freevee. Give the backers early access and downloads and broadcast the season on the streamer. Release some physical media, sell some shirts, MAKE A GODDAM PROFIT, and then make more.
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Post by BoB3K on Nov 26, 2023 13:13:48 GMT -5
One thing that hasn't been brought up much (because there's so much other crap to bring up), but is important to me. I was REALLY turned off by the format changes going back to season 12.
I liked the bumpers in 11, but I can live without them. But, pulling one of the host breaks? trimming the movies even more to fit them in some made up 90- minute timeslot? It turned me off even before host changes and muppet bots.
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Post by Shark on Nov 26, 2023 13:19:08 GMT -5
One thing that hasn't been brought up much (because there's so much other crap to bring up), but is important to me. I was REALLY turned off by the format changes going back to season 12. I liked the bumpers in 11, but I can live without them. But, pulling one of the host breaks? trimming the movies even more to fit them in some made up 90- minute timeslot? It turned me off even before host changes and muppet bots. Thank you! It bugs me to no end when Joel says something like "well, we cut the boring parts". That's a huge cop-out and if you're not creative enough to make those parts entertaining, there's nothing wrong with a little ktma silence. Without the boring parts we don't get refuling or sandstorm. I'm on team bumper and regular host breaks too.
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Post by monkeypretzel on Nov 26, 2023 13:33:28 GMT -5
If they just came out and said they were editing down every movie to 70 minutes to make a 90 minute show (with host segments and endless credits) in order to have the potential for it to fit easily into a streaming or network timeslot, I'd be a lot less salty about the editing.
I'm also salty about The Mads editing down to 60 minutes, more or less, too, especially when the movie is only 65, 68 minutes to start. What, Frank can't hold it for an extra five minutes?
Yes, RiffTrax does it too, but there it doesn't bother me as much because much of it is for violence and nudity and gore and I don't like violence and gore and the less I see of it, the better. Plus a lot of the movies they severely edit aren't ones I'm interested in watching over and over. Yeah, I know this is hypocritical of me.
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Post by CrowTrobotfan92 on Nov 26, 2023 13:35:08 GMT -5
I'm not as big on the revamped stuff personally. That said it is a shame to see season 14 didn't work out.
Far as I can say.... Probably just have to throw in the towel now. Maybe Joel might be able to find another miracle, but it's clearly not happening right now.
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Post by Megalon on Nov 26, 2023 13:35:45 GMT -5
Good letter from Joel. He said everything that needed to be said, and I hope the show has a future with these other partners he mentioned.
Personally, I'd love to see the show go back to a more traditional model where the product is made first, and we, the consumers, either buy it or don't. I've never liked how the crowdfunding model flips that paradigm on its head by asking the audience to buy a product before they've even seen it.
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Post by BoB3K on Nov 26, 2023 14:10:59 GMT -5
by asking the audience to buy a product before they've even seen it. I think this is a really important point for this failed campaign. The first two KS, this was happening, but Joel, et al, were all over talking about what people would be getting and hyping it up big time. The first KS, they mostly delivered, the second KS, not as much, but they did deliver. And now here we are. I'm guessing that Joel and (the shrunken) et al thought they could get away with not bothering to tell people what they were getting before they've seen it cuz they have their established loving fan base of the last 3 great seasons, and they were totally wrong. Lot's of fans were actually very concerned with what the were buying before seeing it. And a lot of people just don't like that model and only did it the first two times because of the circumstances, and said no more.
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