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Post by crowschmo on Apr 6, 2021 13:52:49 GMT -5
Keeping my fingers crossed that this will be a more honed endeavor. Hell, even a bunch of shorts released somehow would be good for now until the format is "movie ready."
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Torgo
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Post by Torgo on Apr 6, 2021 14:02:19 GMT -5
They do have all the sets built and for the most part they're ready to rock and roll. Hopefully a lot of the creative process is past them and they can get down to writing and production.
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Post by slainmonkey on Apr 6, 2021 14:24:20 GMT -5
I mean really, they already have the sets. They could certainly cut cost by being less fancy with the cinema segments, and just do it like they used to in the show’s original run. Like others have said, they’d certainly do better focusing squarely on the writing, and cutting costs by recycling as many assets as possible!
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Post by mylungswereaching on Apr 6, 2021 14:34:12 GMT -5
It's partly the writing but I think its the performing that's just as important. From what I've read, the theater people weren't even in the same room when they read their lines. They really don't have the timing to play off each other properly.
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Post by Diet Kolos on Apr 6, 2021 14:38:30 GMT -5
If anything, and I know this is an outdated way of thinking, I hope they're aiming at traditional cable TV release. And I'll tell you why...
When they shot for streaming, they had the shoot everything quick and at once. Everything was written at once. It all felt rushed, because it was. If they get a TV contract at, say, IFC for 13 episodes, they can take their time. Shoot it over 6 months, write one episode at a time, develop a real writers room, etc.
I know this is probably not what they're aiming for, but I think it'd solve a lot of issues.
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Post by Troy's Dad on Apr 6, 2021 14:42:37 GMT -5
Weekly releases should be considered. The Netflix dump killed all conversation and surprise. Cameos lost their impact. Season 12 made it work, with the binge concept, but that is a one and done idea that they cannot repeat. My personal hope is season 13 sees a return to Castle Forrester OR the series being set underwater (Deep Sea 13).
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Post by Udvarnoky on Apr 6, 2021 14:45:55 GMT -5
If anything, and I know this is an outdated way of thinking, I hope they're aiming at traditional cable TV release. And I'll tell you why... When they shot for streaming, they had the shoot everything quick and at once. Everything was written at once. It all felt rushed, because it was. If they get a TV contract at, say, IFC for 13 episodes, they can take their time. Shoot it over 6 months, write one episode at a time, develop a real writers room, etc. I know this is probably not what they're aiming for, but I think it'd solve a lot of issues. I don't think the method of release is what made them shoot everything in an extremely condensed block of binge shooting. I think it was more to do with cost and cast availability. Whatever the cause, I agree with you: It is a defect, to be corrected.
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Torgo
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Post by Torgo on Apr 6, 2021 14:51:17 GMT -5
When they shot for streaming, they had the shoot everything quick and at once. That wasn't just because of streaming. That was also due to cast availability. Patton alone has several shows he juggles simultaneously, including a popular sitcom on Peacock. Felicia and Baron also keep multiple projects on the table (Baron just made his directorial debut last year). Jonah and Hampton are more low key, but they still have side projects. What you're calling for is for these people to make MST their full time job, which is not going to happen. That would take a whole new cast of unknowns working as guerilla as the original cast did and just doing comedy gigs down the street to make ends meet. But, for better or worse, television is in a different place and television like that is few and far between.
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Post by BoB3K on Apr 6, 2021 14:55:41 GMT -5
My hope is they have a streaming partner already lined up (Shudder would be great) The issue with that is that Shudder isn't that wide of a streaming service. You can't ask for a bunch of kickstarter donations and then say, okay we'll see you next year after you get your Shudder account set up. They could make them available as downloads to kickstarters, but if you do that, i don't see why you don't just go all the way and make them straight downloads form Shout! -- like how RiffTrax just has direct purchase/downloads. And then the streaming stuff is just a side thing. They do have all the sets built and for the most part they're ready to rock and roll. Hopefully a lot of the creative process is past them and they can get down to writing and production. That's probably far from a certainty. It's very possible that they 'struck the sets' when they were done shooting. Keeping in mind that Joel went all Hollywood for the Reboot, it's very likely there were just renting shooting space to begin with. I'm sure they still have some stuff like the puppets and costumes. But, that could be it.
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Post by Diet Kolos on Apr 6, 2021 14:58:17 GMT -5
When they shot for streaming, they had the shoot everything quick and at once. That wasn't just because of streaming. That was also due to cast availability. Patton alone has several shows he juggles simultaneously, including a popular sitcom on Peacock. Felicia and Baron also keep multiple projects on the table (Baron just made his directorial debut last year). Jonah and Hampton are more low key, but they still have side projects. What you're calling for is for these people to make MST their full time job, which is not going to happen. That would take a whole new cast of unknowns working as guerilla as the original cast did and just doing comedy gigs down the street to make ends meet. But, for better or worse, television is in a different place and television like that is few and far between. And that's a shame. It really is. And that's where 90% of the charm of the original is lost. And if that can't be rectified, I'm not sure what can be done about it or if its a salvageable product.
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Torgo
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Post by Torgo on Apr 6, 2021 15:00:07 GMT -5
That's probably far from a certainty. It's very possible that they 'struck the sets' when they were done shooting. Keeping in mind that Joel went all Hollywood for the Reboot, it's very likely there were just renting shooting space to begin with. I'm sure they still have some stuff like the puppets and costumes. But, that could be it. I highly doubt they got rid of the sets. The scenario from Joel and Shout is that they always intended for MST to come back. The sets were likely taken apart and put in storage, while the filming space was cleared out for other people to rent.
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Post by BoB3K on Apr 6, 2021 15:00:34 GMT -5
That wasn't just because of streaming. Patton alone has several shows he juggles simultaneously, ... Felicia and Baron also keep multiple projects on the table (Baron ...). Jonah and Hampton ... ... That would take a whole new cast of unknowns working as guerilla as the original cast did and just doing comedy gigs down the street to make ends meet. ... would that be so bad? ...No, it does't matter, it aint gonna happen. And I have nothing against Jonah. But, I really wouldn't care for a whole new cast if they were able to be full time.
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Post by BoB3K on Apr 6, 2021 15:03:53 GMT -5
That's probably far from a certainty. It's very possible that they 'struck the sets' when they were done shooting. I highly doubt they got rid of the sets. The scenario from Joel and Shout is that they always intended for MST to come back. The sets were likely taken apart and put in storage, while the filming space was cleared out for other people to rent. I agree, I'm just saying it's possible. Not to mention, it really should be one of the lesser issues for a "cow town puppet show". If I recall, for the original show, Joel threw the original puppets together the night before the first day, and he and Trace built most of the sets themselves over a couple of days.
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Torgo
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Post by Torgo on Apr 6, 2021 15:08:42 GMT -5
That wasn't just because of streaming. Patton alone has several shows he juggles simultaneously, ... Felicia and Baron also keep multiple projects on the table (Baron ...). Jonah and Hampton ... ... That would take a whole new cast of unknowns working as guerilla as the original cast did and just doing comedy gigs down the street to make ends meet. ... would that be so bad? ...No, it does't matter, it aint gonna happen. And I have nothing against Jonah. But, I really wouldn't care for a whole new cast if they were able to be full time. It doesn't really matter if it is or not. MST was a product of just being its own little monster. Any continuation of it is either something that needs to franchise out or it needs to clear out for the new guy. Take Joe Bob Briggs' revival on Shudder. When Joe Bob worked MonsterVision, he came in weekly and filmed his stuff for that week. Nowadays he has to film everything in a span of a few days and they release it months later, even on a weekly schedule. It's just efficient for the people he's working for and it's how TV is done today. Same is probably likely for Svengoolie, though I haven't heard much about his shooting schedule, and he's on a cable channel. The time of the little niche homemade program is pretty much dead in the water.
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Post by Diet Kolos on Apr 6, 2021 15:14:01 GMT -5
But then again, if we're even having a Kickstarter to begin with, that begs the question, why can't Joel just get a young fresh group of faces that cost nothing and shoot the show somewhere that costs nothing and do it that way if you're being funded solely by fans?
We know this time the show definitely isn't going to Netflix. If some other streaming service like HBO Max were to pick it up you would think a prefunded season based on a Kickstarter would not be a prerequisite for them, and of course it might make it more attractive because it's already paid for, but then Joel and co. are just repeating the mistake that made with Netflix where you get one season the streaming service doesn't pay for and 1/4 of another season and then you're quickly canceled. Mass-marketability didn't do a whole hell of a lot for the show's fanbase growth the last time and the show got canceled again anyways. So what's the point of this Kickstarter if not to appeal to the actual fans? Why are we stuck doing this big LA production still? When it obviously had big drawbacks in the first place? Why NOT go guerilla with it, the money is still going to come in from fans regardless.
Like, Joel could easily raise 3 million from fans and shoot six episodes or so on his own at his own pace if they did it guerilla style. They have backing from Shout on movie rights and their own streaming service. You don't need the big corporate streaming platforms and backing. Especially since we all agree that MST is a niche.
Hopefully Joel answers some of these questions like what they actually want for the show and where they want it shown.
It's just...very depressing that the way they shoot it is clearly the way it's GOT to be and the way its always going to be from here on out. It just isn't wholly compatible with MST. It feels wrong. And the resultant product comes out feeling wrong.
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